Last play of the game, 4th down, inadvertant whistle

futurecoach · #1 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 02:27pm

Hi everyone. I am taking an Officiating class for my degree requirements to be a coach we had a question about a situation that I'd like to know how you call it.

Situation:

It is fourth down with 4 seconds left. The ball is snapped and after time runs out the play is blown dead due to an inadvertant whistle. Do you award an untimed down?

I think, according to rule 3-3-3c that you do give an untimed down. The guys in class were saying that since it is 4th down you don't.

What are you supposed to do?

futurecoach · #2 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 02:32pm

Oh, would the spot of the ball matter also? I guess does it matter if the runner/receiver actually got the the 1st before the whistle?

kdf5 · #3 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 02:39pm

If there's an IW during a down or during a down in which the penalty for a foul is declined then you do the following:

Legal forward pass or snap in flight or during a legal kick you replay the down

If ball is loose after a backward pass, fumble illegal forward pass or illegal kick, the team last in possession may choose to put the ball in play where possession was lost or replay the down

If the ball's in player possession that team may choose to accept the play at that spot or replay the down.

Patton · #4 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 02:53pm

And YES, since this occurred during the last timed downed of a period you would play at least one untimed down.

futurecoach · #5 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 02:54pm

Spot of the ball wouldn't matter...it would be like they get 4th down all over again?

Patton · #6 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 03:03pm

Quote:

Originally posted by futurecoach
Spot of the ball wouldn't matter...it would be like they get 4th down all over again?

Spot of and status of the ball are critical in determining what to do after an inadvertent whistle occurs. There's not enough information in your question to answer where the ball would be spotted. The question was would you play an untimed down and the answer is yes.

futurecoach · #7 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 03:09pm

So if the play wouldn't have resulted in a first down anyways...game over. If it would have resulted in a first down, give the untimed. This sound right to you?

mcrowder · #8 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 03:15pm

No.

The simple way to remember this is that if you have to REPLAY THE DOWN, your run an untimed play. If the play in question is accepted as is, the quarter is over.

Patton · #9 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 03:17pm

Rule 3-3-3 States: "A period must be extended by an untimed down if during the last timed down of the period, one of the following occurs: (c) There was an inadvertent whistle". So regardless of whether a 1st down was made or not is irrelevant. We will have at least one untimed down.

SoGARef · #10 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 04:07pm

Futurecoach,

An easy way to think of it is like this. If there is an IW and the team in possession chooses to replay the down all it means is that the down that the IW was on never happened. You go back to the previous spot and replay the down. If the clock has run out, then it is an untimed down. Doesn't really matter what down it is because the game is over when that down ends.

mcrowder · #11 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 04:13pm

Patton - does this mean that in FED, if there's an IW, but the result of the play is accepted (i.e. the down is NOT replayed), you have to run another play?

Patton · #12 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 24, 2004, 04:53pm

Quote:

Originally posted by mcrowder
Patton - does this mean that in FED, if there's an IW, but the result of the play is accepted (i.e. the down is NOT replayed), you have to run another play?

As the rule reads, yes that is correct.

BoomerSooner · #13 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 25, 2004, 11:31am

Probably the best way I've ever had the IW explained to me is this...(assuming ball in possession no fumbles, no pass in the air, nothing like that)...The team in possesion has the choice of replaying the down or taking the play down where the whistle was blown.

So for example, 4th and 10 at the 50, A18 fakes a handoff to A28 who goes into the line and is tackled. R blows the whistle thinking A28 had the ball, but A18 is 10 yards down the field around the end. The linesman on that end should have picked up the QB with the ball and marked him down where he was at when the whistle was blown.

Now comes the decision for A, under normal circumstances, they would likely take the play resulting in a 1st and 10 at the B40. However as applied to this circumstance, 1st and 10 at B40 does nothing for them, because if the keep the play then the game is over...no replay of the down. However with any IW, the team in possesion is given the choice to replay the play regardless of the game situation (time, down, distance, score don't matter). So as time has expired A will likely want to replay the down so we go back 4th and 10 at the 50 with an untimed down since the clock expired on IW play.

Jim S · #14 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 25, 2004, 01:40pm

The inadvertant whistle gives the option to accept the result of the play. This does not affect the IW whistle rule. In this case if A does not reach the line to gain they must replay the down. Otherwise the ball would go over to B and there would still be an untimed down.
The only time the IW would not extend would be if there was an accepted foul that occured during the down.

The Roamin' Umpire · #15 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 25, 2004, 08:30pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Jim S
The only time the IW would not extend would be if there was an accepted foul that occured during the down.

In which case, of course, the period would be extended for the accepted penalty anyway.