Too Late For 11th Man To Enter Field?

Blue37 · #1 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 18, 2004, 04:30pm

I was watching my son's high school team last night (fed rules) and something interesting happened. We were on defense and the other team was punting. We only had ten players on the field and the 11th started to run on, but the linesman prevented him from doing so by sticking his arm out and blocking his path. There was no contact between the player and the official. The linesman then said something over his shoulder to the coach. Afer the game, I asked about the situation and was told the linesman said defensive players were not allowed to enter the field after the offense broke the huddle.

Is that the rule? As long as it is an honest mistake and not an attempt to gain an advantage, is it ever too late for the 11th player to enter the field? What about if the ball has been snapped? Is NCAA different?

Thanks in advance.

PS - We won the game so this is not sour grapes. Just an honest desire to learn.

jumpmaster · #2 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 18, 2004, 05:28pm

I got nothing. I think the L was wrong. As long as the ball hasn't been snapped, I don't see a problem.

Theisey · #3 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 18, 2004, 07:43pm

Gads, I hate it when officials dream up some funky off the wall rule.
There is no such rule in either code. A Player can come in anytime. It is a foul if the snap has occurred, but that's about all.

Snake~eyes · #4 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 18, 2004, 11:16pm

Are you sure that's what the L said? I just find that hard to believe that someone can make a rule like that up.

Jim S · #5 (**permalink**) Sun Sep 19, 2004, 12:23am

No Such rule. The only thing that even comes close 9is a rule that requires all offensive players be within 15 yards of the ball at some time before the ball is snapped. And also that they (along with the rest of the team) be still 1 second.

sir_eldren · #6 (**permalink**) Sun Sep 19, 2004, 03:47am

Quite an interesting ruling. The Linesman may have been a newer official and may not have understood that silly restrictions are placed on the offense, but even then it's possible to enter a man after the huddle breaks.

Today I had a game where I was the umpire and a number of times one of the teams place too few players on the field. Once I counted 9, and at least 4 times I counted 10. They always got their 11th man in though. The catch to the defensive side of the ball is that the player has to meet two requirements to be considered eligible: At the snap, the player must (1) be on the field, and (2) be on his team's side of the neutral zone. If he meets requirement #1, but fails to meet #2 by the snap, then we've got encroachment. If two men step on the field (on their own side) just before the snap and participate (provided it doesn't put them over 11), it's perfectly legal and play shall continue.

-Craig

Jim S · #7 (**permalink**) Sun Sep 19, 2004, 01:40pm

Quote:

Originally posted by sir_eldren
The catch to the defensive side of the ball is that the player has to meet two requirements to be considered eligible: At the snap, the player must (1) be on the field, and (2) be on his team's side of the neutral zone. If he meets requirement #1, but fails to meet #2 by the snap, then we've got encroachment.
-Craig

Not encroachment under NFHS rules. This is a foul for illegal substitution, as long as he does not participate. If he does, it becomes an illegal participation foul.
BTW, encroachment means breaking the neutral zone, not being on the other side of the ball. What is the foul, if any, for a defensive player (legal player, not a sub) being in A's backfield at the snap? He was there since the end of the previus play. (I know is a theoretical situation, it's for purpose of the rule.)

sir_eldren · #8 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 20, 2004, 03:19am

Ahh... That's correct. I don't know why I thought it would be encroachment. *shrug* But I did know it's a 5-yard penalty on the defense. ;o)

As for the theoretical situation: we would have an official's blunder. The referee should not have marked the ball ready for play. The defenseman should have been directed to the proper side of the neutral zone prior to chop, and if he refused then we could technically mark it ready and throw a flag for encroachment, although that would be a horrible thing to do and should never be done. LOL!

-Craig

mikesears · #9 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 20, 2004, 06:33am

Quote:

Originally posted by sir_eldren
Ahh... That's correct. I don't know why I thought it would be encroachment. *shrug* But I did know it's a 5-yard penalty on the defense. ;o)

As for the theoretical situation: we would have an official's blunder. The referee should not have marked the ball ready for play. The defenseman should have been directed to the proper side of the neutral zone prior to chop, and if he refused then we could technically mark it ready and throw a flag for encroachment, although that would be a horrible thing to do and should never be done. LOL!

-Craig

It wouldn't be encroachment until the snapper put his hands on the ball. The only way this situation would be encroachment is if the B player were to touch the ball, an A player, or to give defensive signals.