Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 944519)

Why do old interpretations matter? I can't point to them in the rule/case book, so why should I be explaining to a coach that according to some interp from x years ago his team running around the opponents side of the court during warmups is a technical foul?? Can someone explain why I should care/know about old interps?

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 944516)

Thx. I guess what I believe is that this old play from the interps deals with situation where I fumble going up, regain control while in the air, intentionally drop it and then grab it on ground. When I am the first to touch it on the ground it is said that the act of dropping it was a start of dribble. Started dribble without pivot foot on floor. Travel. The explanation in your play says that while airborne, player has to release it on a try or pass. He has to have control for that which is why I believe when they add the term "drop" to your play they consider that regaining control. If you look at other plays in rule,4 you will see they also use term "drop" to mean an intentional act as opposed to a fumble.

Also, the travel rules for NFHS are understood to be same as ncaa. I believe when you fumble the ball you can recover it always. What you can do after you recover it depends...let me know what u think. Thx

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 944509)

I got a fumble, not a shot attempt. He is losing it on the way up before any contact. And I would be inclined to call nothing in the scramble for the ball. But I can see a foul being called, I just probably would let the play continue.

Peace

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 944521)

I agree with your logic completely. It is really hard to tell someone you know what you are doing when you cannot prove it to anyone, unless you see it in a very special place. Not everyone is going to come to this site to know what to do. And if you started officiating well after an interpretation, then you are at a big disadvantage. I have been saying what you have been saying for years. If the interpretations still applies, it should be in the casebook still. Otherwise we are just using a certain kind of knowledge as law in these kinds of cases.

Peace

Originally Posted by Kansas Ref (Post 944607)

I could not tell what violation our ref had in the video--could not see his mechanic--was it clear to anyone else on our forum?

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 944589)

i can understand why you might want that to be the rule---player fumbled going up to pass or shoot, he made mistake. say he can't touch it first. put it in the case book. what's in the case book is the play where dribbler ends his dribble, fumbles and is allowed to go get it. language says he can always retrieve fumble. why allow that and not allow shooter or passer to retrieve his fumble…
and why put one in case book and not the other…..sorry I'm rambling...

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 944627)

The NFHS may change the rule to match the NCAA at some point in the future, but that hasn't happened yet.

The reason that there is a difference between this ruling and the dribble one in the NFHS Case Book is that the dribbling player has not yet lifted his pivot foot into the air. As you can read for yourself in 4-44, once a player picks up his pivot, the ball must be passed or shot. If not, by rule, a traveling violation has occurred.

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 944648)

I think I see what u r saying

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 944654)

I'm saying that in that Case Book play, we should understand that the player ended his dribble and then fumbled the ball BEFORE lifting his pivot foot. Thus there is no problem with the provision of the traveling rule and he may go retrieve the ball.

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 944864)

Nevada,

Tell me what you do on the jump stop play. (the one where player ends dribble with one foot on floor, jumps and lands simultaneously on two feet. neither can be a pivot.) plz assume player touches ball with two hands just prior to the foot leaving the ground. fumbles while in air in process of ending dribble. ball goes 5 feet away. he goes and recovers. thx

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 944870)

It seems to me that the player fumbled the ball before lifting his pivot foot, so the same answer would apply.

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 944870)

It seems to me that the player fumbled the ball before lifting his pivot foot, so the same answer would apply.

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 944876)

lets say he fumbled the ball just after he left the ground. he didnt have a pivot foot at the time but he also wasnt required to to shoot or pass. he could come down simultaneously on both feet.