Pre Game Conversation With Coaches

[Robert E. Harrison]

I find out who is game management and where to locate a trainer if needed and available. Verify properly and legally equipped and not eschew good sportsmanship to all.

Cadillac position is the old position in which the lead and trail official are table side and the center is opposite the table. I liked it because there are 2 officials that have similar views of the play as the coaches.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Robert E. Harrison

I find out who is game management and where to locate a trainer if needed and available. Verify properly and legally equipped and not eschew good sportsmanship to all.

Cadillac position is the old position in which the lead and trail official are table side and the center is opposite the table. I liked it because there are 2 officials that have similar views of the play as the coaches.

That's not the context in which I was using it.

Back in the day, the official always had to be on the left side of the court when facing play (2-person, of course). Therefore, if you inbounded the ball on the right (as opposed to left) side of the court, you had to look for an opportunity to cross over (the trail always initiated these crossovers and then the lead would follow suit). Completely idiotic that anyone ever thought you could work the game better this way and the "other" orientation was backwards and not ideal. Of course in those days the T had to receive a bounce pass from the lead and HAND the ball to the FT shooter on ALL free throws. Then for a couple of years we were allowed to bounce to the shooter as the lead on subsequent FTs, but the T had to administer the first one.

What you mention was the original 3-person layout that may or may not still be used in Louisiana (it was as of a few years ago - I made fun of it then). C was always opposite. It was an idiotic system because the C would be forced to cover half of the court and had an almost 50% chance to be on-ball, too. It may have also been known as Cadillac, I have no idea.

[BillyMac]

I'm sure that Whitman was talking about the second horn.

Originally Posted by Welpe

Per the rules, how many captains are on each team?

One, and only one, captain, from each team. 3-1-1 "Each team consists of five players, one of whom is the captain."

Originally Posted by Welpe

How many are usually sent to the meeting?

I've had as many as eight. We were getting in the way of the layup lines. It was like a freaking football game.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Welpe

OK I've seen the Cadillac position reference enough without asking...what was it?

In two man, there used to be a preference that for each official the court and players were boxed in to their right. So, if I'm T and I'm facing the endline, the basket is to my right side.

When I first started officiating in college, this was the mechanic. By the time I started doing it again after college, it was gone.

Note: I might be wrong on which side it was, but the concept is there.

Edited to add: Anyone who says the word "eschew" in a captains meeting is asking for trouble.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Adam

I stopped asking once I realized it really didn't matter. I'd be fine if we got rid of this holdover practice.

Where do I sign the petition?

Also. I'll talk to any player who asks a polite question, including "the" captain, any other "captains", all the way down to the last kid on the end of the bench.

My, "Ready?", jump ball question is given to all ten players.

Yeah. I know. I'm a rebel. That's just the way that I like to roll.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Rich

Like the trail signaling with two fingers after every made basket...the trail administering every free throw...the lack of action rule...working Cadillac and live-ball crossing over the court to "get back in Cadillac"....the fouler being required to raise his/her hand

... getting paid $15.00 per game.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Rich

Me too. Till they do officially, I'll continue to do it -- partially as one of those things that ties me back to the days when I started officiating.

To be honest, I don't care if others do this or not -- but I like to know what's in the books before I decide whether to follow along.

(Some of the old practices from my early years seem downright bizarre compared to this one. Like the trail signaling with two fingers after every made basket...the trail administering every free throw...the lack of action rule...working Cadillac and live-ball crossing over the court to "get back in Cadillac"....the fouler being required to raise his/her hand (that one predates me).)

I recall cadillac. I recall playing when we had to raise our hands (although that may have just been a hold-over). I do remember trail administering the first free throw. I do remember signaling all made baskets.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

... getting paid $15.00 per game.

Why does Louisiana keep coming up?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by AremRed

I can't tell if you are serious.

I can tell you that I always ask.

It's also useful if you need to tell them to get out of the TO huddle a little earler, or "speak to #xx about yyyyyyyyy".

Both comments are used a dozen times or so a season.

[Ref16]

In Tennessee we have 2 separate meetings also...

My coaches or " administrators" meeting comes first, ideally around the 11:00-12:00 minute mark. The game administrator does most of the talking. My part consists of-"Good luck tonight guys, stay in your boxes if you are talking to us and relatively close if your not (POI this year). Remember that respectfully asked questions will get respectfully answered questions and we will answer those questions but will not respond to statements. Sportsmanship is important tonight from all players and all coaches. We are going to work hard and officiate a good ball game. Good luck to both of your teams."

Captains meeting is ideally at the 5:00 minute mark and goes something like this: "Who is the floor captain? You guys are the leaders of your teams for a reason so act like leaders on the floor. Sportsmanship is key tonight and any unsporting acts will be dealt with accordingly. Play hard and good luck."

Admin meeting is usually less than 1:00 min long unless game admin goes longer with his talk than normal, captains meeting is always quick...the longest part of it is waiting on them to get done shaking hands so we can begin the meeting!

And I am in agreement with those who have said that they don't actually hear us....it all goes in one ear and out the other! But because it is asked of us, it will always be done in my games...

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Adam

I recall cadillac. I recall playing when we had to raise our hands (although that may have just been a hold-over). I do remember trail administering the first free throw. I do remember signaling all made baskets.

I didn't realize you were that ol---seasoned.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Welpe

I didn't realize you were that ol---seasoned.

Get off my lawn

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I can tell you that I always ask. It's also useful if you need ... "speak to #xx about yyyyyyyyy".

I have used captains for this in the past, however, I will utilize any of the multiple captains, and, in fact, any player that I can identify as a "leader" on the team.

I know the rules tell us that each team has only one captain, but I really don't have any use for "floor captains", or "speaking captains". If I need a player to give me a hand, I'll find one, or more than one, whether they have an imaginary "C" on their jersey, or not.

I'd actually prefer to talk to a coach, but in the ebb, and flow, of the game, it's sometimes easier to talk to a player.

[frezer11]

As long as we're in the discussion of outdated processes, what is the purpose of signaling the "C" or the player number when reporting a time-out? It's another thing that doesn't get written the book, and I've never understood why even have it as a mechanic.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by frezer11

As long as we're in the discussion of outdated processes, what is the purpose of signaling the "C" or the player number when reporting a time-out? It's another thing that doesn't get written the book, and I've never understood why even have it as a mechanic.

I do it for reference purposes.