Who's the shooter?

[Sharpshooternes]

A1 fouls B1 in the second half. Coach requests timeout. This foul happened to be the seventh foul putting B in the bonus. Official is reporting the foul then the time out and the players are mostly back to the benches at this time. It is about here that the scorekeeper informs us that it is the 7th foul. We did not mark the shooter. (I understand we blew it by not marking the shooter) but what is the best way to handle this after the fact when you don't really know who the shooter is? We tried waiting to see if someone would line up coming out of the timeout but it was girls ball so of course they had no idea what was going on. We then asked "Who got fouled before the timeout?" and no one really wanted to fess up they ended up choosing someone on their team and we got going. Of course the opposing coach didn't like that much, rightfully so. But I didn't have any way to determine properly who the shooter should be. Anyone have some constructive advice on how to handle this situation aside from knowing the foul count and marking the shooter after every play?

[JetMetFan]

Ask...in this order...your partner, the table and then the kids. Usually the kid who is supposed to shoot will step up. If they don't that means they're a lousy FT shooter.

[Sharpshooternes]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

Ask...in this order...your partner, the table and then the kids. Usually the kid who is supposed to shoot will step up. If they don't that means they're a lousy FT shooter.

So they didn't step up to the line. Anybody oppossed to picking someone and making them shoot? this would take it out of the shooting teams'/coach's hands to pick the best shooter. At least it would be random.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Sharpshooternes

So they didn't step up to the line. Anybody oppossed to picking someone and making them shoot? this would take it out of the shooting teams'/coach's hands to pick the best shooter. At least it would be random.

What other option is there? (Asking the other team's coach isn't one of them. And there is no IR even if it is there.)

[RookieDude]

I think most officials have probably "lost a shooter" some how, some way during their career.

I can't believe you guys couldn't get a player to fess up. I guess we have been persuasive enough when this situation has come up...I suppose if you couldn't get an answer from the shooting team...maybe you could ask the person that got called for the foul who they fouled.?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

What other option is there? (Asking the other team's coach isn't one of them. And there is no IR even if it is there.)

Mybe I'm slow this morning -- IR?

Originally Posted by RookieDude

I can't believe you guys couldn't get a player to fess up. I guess we have been persuasive enough when this situation has come up...I suppose if you couldn't get an answer from the shooting team...maybe you could ask the person that got called for the foul who they fouled.?

"Psst -- hey, who were you guarding?" (assuming that it wasn't a secondary defender, or a scrum-on-a-rebound foul, etc.)

[Tio]

What could you have done to prevent this situation? In the second half, near the end of the game, you should be expecting bonus, expecting fifth foul, etc. You should never be surprised by a bonus situation. Do not expect the table to do it for you. Second, I highly recommend being aware of the foul count (on the scoreboard) and even going as far as communicating when the next foul will result in bonus with your crew during the game. If there is no foul count on the scoreboard, I would ask the table when you know you are getting close. Once subs start coming in, good luck untangling that mess.

These are little things you can do to avoid unpleasant situations like the one mentioned.

Originally Posted by Sharpshooternes

A1 fouls B1 in the second half. Coach requests timeout. This foul happened to be the seventh foul putting B in the bonus. Official is reporting the foul then the time out and the players are mostly back to the benches at this time. It is about here that the scorekeeper informs us that it is the 7th foul. We did not mark the shooter. (I understand we blew it by not marking the shooter) but what is the best way to handle this after the fact when you don't really know who the shooter is? We tried waiting to see if someone would line up coming out of the timeout but it was girls ball so of course they had no idea what was going on. We then asked "Who got fouled before the timeout?" and no one really wanted to fess up they ended up choosing someone on their team and we got going. Of course the opposing coach didn't like that much, rightfully so. But I didn't have any way to determine properly who the shooter should be. Anyone have some constructive advice on how to handle this situation aside from knowing the foul count and marking the shooter after every play?

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Mybe I'm slow this morning -- IR?

Sorry. By IR I meant video of some sort.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Sorry. By IR I meant video of some sort.

In NCAA, you can use the video monitor to determine who the shooter should be.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

I think most officials have probably "lost a shooter" some how, some way during their career.

I can't believe you guys couldn't get a player to fess up. I guess we have been persuasive enough when this situation has come up...I suppose if you couldn't get an answer from the shooting team...maybe you could ask the person that got called for the foul who they fouled.?

It happens more than once in a career. It's why the NCAA allows the officials to go to the monitor -- it happens to them, too.

Happened to me this season and, fortunately, we figured it out pretty quickly.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

In NCAA, you can use the video monitor to determine who the shooter should be.

I usually reply as though games were high school unless NCAA is specifically mentioned. Maybe I should specify that. lol

[jTheUmp]

Happened to me several times in my first few years. Now I make it a point to say the shooter's number as part of my preliminary signal routine.

Whistle. Fist. "White 42, hold" "23 is our shooter". Then move to report to the table.

If I'm the non-calling official, I will verbalize the (Potential) shooter as soon as I can.

If a timeout is called, I blow the whistle, say "23's our shooter, timeout white" or somesuch.

Helps me remember it.

Of course, if all that fails.... I'd ask, in this order: partner(s), table, players, coaches (both of them). Hopefully it doesn't get past asking my partner(s).

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by jTheUmp

Now I make it a point to say the shooter's number as part of my preliminary signal routine. "White 42, hold" "23 is our shooter".

With the encouragement of my local interpreter, I tried this about twenty-five years ago. By the time I got to the table, it became, ""White 23, hold" "42 is our shooter". Must be something wrong with the axons, and dendrites, in my brain. Now, I just point to the shooter for the benefit of my partner.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by jTheUmp

Happened to me several times in my first few years. Now I make it a point to say the shooter's number as part of my preliminary signal routine.

Whistle. Fist. "White 42, hold" "23 is our shooter". Then move to report to the table.

If I'm the non-calling official, I will verbalize the (Potential) shooter as soon as I can.

If a timeout is called, I blow the whistle, say "23's our shooter, timeout white" or somesuch.

Helps me remember it.

Of course, if all that fails.... I'd ask, in this order: partner(s), table, players, coaches (both of them). Hopefully it doesn't get past asking my partner(s).

If you're my partner, I don't want you to call out a number. Get my shooter -- point at him and say, "Shooter!" but giving the number there would likely scramble my brain at an inopportune moment.

[jTheUmp]

Hmmm... interesting. Might be something to pregame with my partner(s)... if they want me to verbalize the shooter's number when I'm the non-calling official.

I'd prefer my partner's brains unscrambled.