Playing with 4

[iubirdman]

As a coach had a situation come up in our game yesterday, and need clarification on a rule.

Team A has 6 players dressed, one of the takes a charge and gets dinged up and has to leave the game. Team A does not want to play the one sub for the last 20 seconds of the quarter as they want to save her that quarter to play the varsity game.

Have had many officials tell us in the past that if they are dressed, on the bench, healthy and eligible to play they have to play. Last night they told us you could play with 4 and leave an eligible player on the bench, just wondering which is correct.

I loked in the case book last night, and it appears that if you have kids eligible to play, you cannot play with less than 5, but looking for clarification for future reference

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by iubirdman

I loked in the case book last night, and it appears that if you have kids eligible to play, you cannot play with less than 5, but looking for clarification for future reference

That's the rule, but the specific enforcement might depend on the definition of "eligible."

I think they should have had more than 6 players to start with.

[tjones1]

Bob is right. How do you define eligible?

If the coach tells you they don't have anyone available then play on.

It's not up to us to determine why A1 (or whoever) is on the bench but can't play.

[iubirdman]

Thanks, it was in a JV game in Indiana (kids can play both games and 5 quarters total) and in the last few days they had a kid get sick and another quit taking them from 8 to 6.

They wanted the sub to play 2 varsity quarters, and if she would have played the last few seconds she would have only been able to play 1. The other teams 2 JV coaches are also licensed officials and they seemed certain on the rule. Like I mentioned in the past we had been told they had to play if they were on the bench so wanted to get clarification for future reference

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by iubirdman

Last night they told us you could play with 4 and leave an eligible player on the bench, just wondering which is correct.

Good question Coach...we have had many a discussion here on this very topic.

This is how you might like the conversation to go...

Official: "Coach, do you have an eligible player to sub in?"

Coach: "No, I do not."

The conversation may continue...

Official: "But Coach, I see a team member on the bench... suited up."

Coach: "She is not eligible."

That would do it for me...there are some here that may have some different conversation scenarios...stand by...you may get them.

[OKREF]

3-1-1 case book.

A team must play with 5 as long as that number is available. Doesn't say anything about "eligible" player.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

Good question Coach...we have had many a discussion here on this very topic.

This is how you might like the conversation to go...

Official: "Coach, do you have an eligible player to sub in?"

Coach: "No, I do not."

The conversation may continue...

Official: "But Coach, I see a team member on the bench... suited up."

Coach: "She is not eligible."

That would do it for me...there are some here that may have some different conversation scenarios...stand by...you may get them.

Don't get me wrong, I'm letting them do this too... but if you get into the conversation like this, then what do you do in the next quarter when they DO want to play her?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by OKREF

3-1-1 case book.

A team must play with 5 as long as that number is available. Doesn't say anything about "eligible" player.

Define available.

I see no book definition. The coach might define available as - Suzy is not available for the first half because she's playing 2 quarters in the varsity game.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

Good question Coach...we have had many a discussion here on this very topic.

This is how you might like the conversation to go...

Official: "Coach, do you have an eligible player to sub in?"

Coach: "No, I do not."

The conversation may continue...

Official: "But Coach, I see a team member on the bench... suited up."

Coach: "She is not eligible."

That would do it for me...there are some here that may have some different conversation scenarios...stand by...you may get them.

I would end the conversation after the "No, I do not." Good enough for me.

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Don't get me wrong, I'm letting them do this too... but if you get into the conversation like this, then what do you do in the next quarter when they DO want to play her?

Allow him/her to play. If that player is available at that time then they are allowed to play. Player may have been injured or whatever before. If the coach tells me they don't have anyone available then that's all I need to know. If down the road they return to 5 then by rule they may do so.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by OKREF

3-1-1 case book.

A team must play with 5 as long as that number is available. Doesn't say anything about "eligible" player.

Same thing (well, same issue).

Does "I'm holding the player for the V game" mean the player is "not available for this game"?

Might be worth a report to the state / assignor just in case there's some pattern of this and the coach is (or is trying to) get an advantage.

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Don't get me wrong, I'm letting them do this too... but if you get into the conversation like this, then what do you do in the next quarter when they DO want to play her?

I guess we could "what if" this to death...

I have seen a lot, but, I have never had a coach try to put a player in AFTER he said the player was not eligible or available.

I'd have to go case by case...for example:

If a coach tells me his player is not available because of sickness...then said his player miraculously got well...I'm probably letting the player play.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Define available.

I see no book definition. The coach might define available as - Suzy is not available for the first half because she's playing 2 quarters in the varsity game.

If little Suzy is on the bench and in the books, and hasn't been disqualified, she is available to play.

[iubirdman]

It was def not a case of them doing this all the time to try and gain an advantage, and I am pretty good friends with the other teams coaches, just wondering what the rule was.

Not sure what the convo was with the officials and the coach, but the official told us "they are choosing to play with 4 the rest of the half". It was the word choosing that did not seem to fit, if the explanation was they have 2 hurt right now and only have 4 that can play that is a lot different to me than they are choosing to play with 4.

I guess we will see a bunch of answers unless we actually know what an available player means. We have always taken it to mean a healthy player who has not fouled out and has quarters available to play and is on the bench as kids that are available

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by tjones1

I would end the conversation after the "No, I do not." Good enough for me.

...and it would be good enough for me as well.

I was simply giving the coach a response to the officials who want to pursue the matter of a suited team member on the bench.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by OKREF

If little Suzy is on the bench and in the books, and hasn't been disqualified, she is available to play.

I'm not quibbling with the coach here. If he says she isn't available, it's not my place to disagree.