Murray State v. Marquette

[APG]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ringo

Two plays that would be good to see:

1) 8:20 to go in 1st half of Murray St./Marquette... Would any of you went with offensive foul?

[SNIPERBBB]

I could go PC on this one since the shoulder charge is what leads to the defender getting knocked a few feet back and his arms to lose verticality.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ringo
Two plays that would be good to see:

1) 8:20 to go in 1st half of Murray St./Marquette... Would any of you went with offensive foul?

Nope.

Defender was moving forward at the time of that contact so they didn't have LGP. Shoulder doesn't mean much of the defender is illegal.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Nope.

Defender was moving forward at the time of that contact so they didn't have LGP. Shoulder doesn't mean much of the defender is illegal.

Camron:

I was going to watch the video but I read your post first and that was all I needed to know.

MTD, Sr.

[Raymond]

Foul was called b/c B1's arms were never vertical, even before A1 contacted him with the shoulder. But B1 was not moving forward at time of contact.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Foul was called b/c B1's arms were never vertical, even before A1 contacted him with the shoulder. But B1 was not moving forward at time of contact.

Look again...B1's feet (foot) were inside the RA just before the shoulder contact and were coming forward...several inches outside of the RA at the time of that contact. Can't get between those two points without moving forward.

The foul that was called was not for that, indeed, but the block/charge element of the play was a block. There was a claim that this body contact caused the arms to not be vertical.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Look again...B1's feet (foot) were inside the RA just before the shoulder contact and were coming forward...several inches outside of the RA at the time of that contact. Can't get between those two points without moving forward.

The foul that was called was not for that, indeed, but the block/charge element of the play was a block. There was a claim that this body contact caused the arms to not be vertical.

Agreed, it wasn't just his feet, either. His torso was moving also.

[just another ref]

Could have easily been a no call.

[Johnny Ringo]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Foul was called b/c B1's arms were never vertical, even before A1 contacted him with the shoulder. But B1 was not moving forward at time of contact.

I agree, B1 arms are not vertical and that's where I think they called the foul, but IMO there is clear displacement from A1 her well prior to the upstairs contact.

Thanks for posting and discussing.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Look again...B1's feet (foot) were inside the RA just before the shoulder contact and were coming forward...several inches outside of the RA at the time of that contact. Can't get between those two points without moving forward.
....

That movement by B1's feet occurred while A1 while still moving laterally. B1's feet were set again before the contact from A1's shoulder.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

That movement by B1's feet occurred while A1 while still moving laterally. B1's feet were set again before the contact from A1's shoulder.

I just can't picture moving your feet forward while moving laterally while you body is connected to your feet.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I just can't picture moving your feet forward while moving laterally while you body is connected to your feet.

Re-read my post.

And look at the video. A1's initial movement takes him in a direction away from the basket. B1 move's his feet forward during A1's initial movement.

PS: if someone moves diagonally they will then have moved laterally and forward relative to their previous position

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Re-read my post.

And look at the video. A1's initial movement takes him in a direction away from the basket. B1 move's his feet forward during A1's initial movement.

PS: if someone moves diagonally they will then have moved laterally and forward relative to their previous position

And if ANY part of that movement, even if there is lateral movement, is forward, that is all that matters. Moving laterally doesn't excuse forward movement. And the forward movement that I'm referring to happened at exactly the time of the shoulder contact. Maybe there was other forward movement too but the only movement that matters is that which occurred at the very moment of contact.

[sounderref]

This is being over-thought and is an easy play. The contact by the offense was marginal, not even close to being enough for a foul. Was the defense vertical...no=foul. If you call a PC on that play you will not be working that level for long.

Side note, notice the L doubling the whistle. This was a routine defensive foul. These are also two of the very best in the tourney, wouldn't be surprised to see the C in the FF (probably an alternate) and the L in a regional semi/final.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Could have easily been a no call.

No. I will call that every time.

Peace