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-   -   Would you call this palming violation? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/85231-would-you-call-palming-violation.html)

BktBallRef Fri Dec 30, 2011 09:43pm

Would you call this palming violation?
 
Under 30 seconds remaining in the game, Team A down 1.

A1 has the ball above the top of the key, isolated with B1. He's dribbling the ball back and forth from one hand to another. He dribbles from his right to his left, hesitates on his toes, left hand comes under the ball and he blows by B1.

You've previously called one palming violation during the game.

The poll is very simple. I don't need an analysis of my description. By rule, a palming violation occurred. Based on the facts given, would you whistle the violation?

just another ref Fri Dec 30, 2011 09:50pm

I thought it was a trick question.


YES Why would anyone not call it?

refiator Fri Dec 30, 2011 10:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 809506)
left hand comes under the ball and he blows by B1.

That's the key...He gained an advantage by being able to beat the defender.
Illegal.
How about the player who obviously "palms" the ball when no defender is present, and makes no move towards the basket? I've seen this called many times......IMO, this is not the intent of the rule...let it go.

Raymond Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:21pm

I've called a palming violation in the last minute of a closely contested game. Happened right if front of the offender's coach. He said nothing of it and my partner did not ask about it after the game.

If it's obvious and created a distinct advantage it's no different than calling a travel, IMO.

BktBallRef Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 809517)
I've called a palming violation in the last minute of a closely contested game. Happened right if front of the offender's coach.

If it's obvious and created a distinct advantage it's no different than calling a travel, IMO.

That's what I thought too...when I made the call.

BillyMac Sat Dec 31, 2011 06:53am

Let's Put The Whistles Away ...
 
Is the implication that the rules change during the last thirty seconds of the game?

Sco53 Sat Dec 31, 2011 08:18am

Does it matter if I am at T, C, or L ?

Indianaref Sat Dec 31, 2011 09:30am

Yes, if created a distinct advantage. Just curious, was the previous palming on the same player or the opponent? Also, did you get a lot of crap for the call?

Adam Sat Dec 31, 2011 11:07am

Quote:

Originally Posted by refiator (Post 809515)
That's the key...He gained an advantage by being able to beat the defender.
Illegal.
How about the player who obviously "palms" the ball when no defender is present, and makes no move towards the basket? I've seen this called many times......IMO, this is not the intent of the rule...let it go.

My threshold goes up for calling this with no defender present, but I will and have called it. Just like three seconds, ten seconds, etc.

BktBallRef Sat Dec 31, 2011 11:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indianaref (Post 809574)
Yes, if created a distinct advantage. Just curious, was the previous palming on the same player or the opponent? Also, did you get a lot of crap for the call?


Don't recall the player in the first one. No crap though.

BillyMac Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:24pm

Pat You On The Back, Or Stab You In The Back ???
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 809586)
My threshold goes up for calling this with no defender present, but I will and have called it. Just like three seconds, ten seconds, etc.

Snaqwells: I can't quite figure out whether to agree with you, or disagree with you, on your last statement.

Are you saying your "threshold goes up for calling" ten seconds in the backcourt "with no defender present"?

BillyMac Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:25pm

Relevant ???
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Indianaref (Post 809574)
Was the previous palming on the same player or the opponent?

And this makes a difference, why?

Indianaref Sat Dec 31, 2011 03:16pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 809609)
And this makes a difference, why?

Never said it did make a difference! If the same player had done it earlier, he should have known better, if it was a player on the other team, at least there is an appearance of fairness.

just another ref Sat Dec 31, 2011 03:25pm

I was wondering if the person who cast the single negative vote would care to comment and explain his position on this issue. I can only guess it would be something along the lines of "Don't let a call like this decide the game," of something equally profound.

In one of my first varsity games, I called a lane violation on the offense with 3 seconds left on a free throw that would have iced the game, then called a travel prior to the release on a potential game tying 3 pointer at the buzzer. It missed anyway.

BillyMac Sat Dec 31, 2011 03:34pm

That's What I Thought ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Indianaref (Post 809675)
If it was a player on the other team, at least there is an appearance of fairness.

I have to disagree with you here "pardner". We never have to appear to be fair. We have to be fair. All the time.

Trading calls may help us to appear to be fair, but it doesn't necessarily make us fair. I never want to walk down that street, and I've been around the block many, many times.


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