Let's take a poll......

[Mark Padgett]

For a few years, many of us have been asking the NF to issue a case on the following play:

A1 to inbound. A1 releases the ball toward the court. After it is out of his hands, but before the ball crosses the OOB line it is touched by B1 who has broken the plane (after the release). There have been no prior delay warnings against team B. The correct ruling is:

A. technical foul on B1
B. delay of game warning on team B
C. no call

We have debated the point previously as to whether there is definitive language in the rule book to make this determination. The closest to a ruling I have ever heard is that Camron Rust said he asked Howard Mayo, who is the commissioner of the Portland Basketball Officials Association and a former member of the NF rules committee and that Howard said it is a technical foul on B1 (I think I'm quoting Camron correctly - I'm sure he'll correct me if I am not).

Please vote either A, B or C as to either how you have been instructed to call it or have come to your own conclusion. I'm really looking just for a consensus, not to start another discussion quoting rules or for a long liturgy of comments. Thanks.

[bob jenkins]

C.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
[B]

C. no call

[B]

[Woodee]

B


Why:
What coach teaches his/her players to jump OOB during a throw-in? I teach my players to jump straight up and down. The ball must have a chance to cross the OOB line during a throw-in, therefore delay of game warning.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Woodee


B
Why:
What coach teaches his/her players to jump OOB during a throw-in?

A question I cannot answer. Do not even know if that is the issue here.

Originally posted by Woodee

I teach my players to jump straight up and down. The ball must have a chance to cross the OOB line during a throw-in, therefore delay of game warning.

You need to read 9-2-11:

"The opponent(s) of the thrower shall not have any part of his/her person through the inbounds side of the throw-in boundary plane until the ball has been released on the throw-in pass."

There is nothing that suggest that the ball must come across the line (in the air) as you suggest.

Peace

[BktBallRef]

C.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

The correct answer is none of the above. The play is legal under NFHS rules.

R7-S6-A3: The opponent(s) of the thrower shall not have any part of his/her person through the inbounds side of the throw-in boundary plane until the ball has been released on a throw-in pass. See R9-S2-A11 Penalty.

R9-S2-A11: The opponent(s) of the thrower shall not have any part of his/her person through the inbounds side of the throw-in boundary plane until the ball has been released on a throw-in pass.

While some will argue that my answer is the same as C, I beg to disagree because I agree with Peter Webb the State Interpreter of Maine Principals Association (the HSAA for the State of Maine), as well as the IAABO State Interpreter for Maine, and a two-time member of the NFHS Rules Committee. Peter correctly defines a "no call" as: An infraction of the rules that an official has decided to ignore.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

While some will argue that my answer is the same as C, I beg to disagree because I agree with Peter Webb the State Interpreter of Maine Principals Association (the HSAA for the State of Maine), as well as the IAABO State Interpreter for Maine, and a two-time member of the NFHS Rules Committee. Peter correctly defines a "no call" as: An infraction of the rules that an official has decided to ignore.

When Maine creates a player or players that the rest of the country would envy, I will then care what comes out of that state as it relates to basketball. Until then, there is nothing to call. It is not illegal or against the rules (if that makes you feel better) touch a ball that has been released on a throw-in, anywhere. Behind the line or beyond the line.

Peace

[Nevadaref]

The play is legal. Don't blow the whistle.

[JeffTheRef]

because the 'legality' of reaching to the out-of-bounds side of the plane to deflect a throw-in pass is also an issue when the ball is being 'passed along the endline' after a made basket. In that circumstance, it is perhaps less intuitively obvious reaching through to deflect the ball is OK, but, as 7-6-3 shows, it is.

[mick]

C.

[mdray]

Originally posted by JeffTheRef
because the 'legality' of reaching to the out-of-bounds side of the plane to deflect a throw-in pass is also an issue when the ball is being 'passed along the endline' after a made basket. In that circumstance, it is perhaps less intuitively obvious reaching through to deflect the ball is OK, but, as 7-6-3 shows, it is.

A "pass along the endline" is not a "throw-in" pass....so it would definitely be a technical foul to reach across and touch a pass between teammates that are OOB;
In answer to the poll, I used to understand this sitch to be a legal play. (I remember being told as much at an IAABO camp). But I *would* like to see an official NFHS case play interpretation.
The rules allow the opponent to reach thru the plane after the ball is released.(9-2-11) But they also say if the opponent reaches through & touches the ball, it is a tecnical foul (10-3-12). Rule 10-3-12 is silent regarding whether the ball has been released or not. So I now interpret this sitch to be a technical foul

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
While some will argue that my answer is the same as C, I beg to disagree because I agree with Peter Webb the State Interpreter of Maine Principals Association (the HSAA for the State of Maine), as well as the IAABO State Interpreter for Maine, and a two-time member of the NFHS Rules Committee. Peter correctly defines a "no call" as: An infraction of the rules that an official has decided to ignore.

You're being ridiculous, Mark. There's no need for that.

We're not talking about rulebook terminology here. Everyone here, but you, realizes that C. means that an infraction of the rules has not occurred in this situation, the play is legal, and no call should be made.

BTW, I bet there isn't one other person on this board who knows, or cares, who Peter Webb is.

[mdray]

Peter Webb is one of the finest people I have ever met and an absolute credit to the game of basketball. He was the president of IAABO last year.

[JeffTheRef]

I don't think it's that clear. I used to coach this, and won games with guys calling T's. What if it's a long pass, it hasn't crossed the plane yet, but the putative receiver hasn't established his/her self out-of-bounds at the time the ball is touched?