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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 12:06am
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After I see this the first time, I tell them that they can have their hands up, but they can't wave them. Usually, this works. I'm sure that I've issued second, and even third warnings.
If I thought a kid, after being warned, was doing it just to show me up or to be a smartass, I would probably call the violation. If after warnings and violations, a coach was still telling his team to do it, and a short conversation with him doesn't help, then he gets rung up. The rulebook term for this is "disconcerting the shooter", and the rulebook term for the coach continuing to direct his players to do this even after a conversation is "coach being a jackass."  I also hate it when defenders on the lane shout something, or make a big deal about raising their hands just when the shooter is about to release the ball. Usually they shout something like, "I've got shooter" or "rebound". Certainly these are things that can be said before the release, and it is obvious that they are trying to rattle the shooter, but we almost always let them go. Having said that, I must admit I have, in the past, told a team not to shout when the shooter is ready to release, but only on very rare occasions where the shouting was really disconcerting and intentional. 
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 06:30am
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I had this team that on all Free throws, there coach would have them "get their hands up!!! (Getting ready to rebound) But what some started to do is to wave their hands in a sort of way that would distract the free thrower. We call this a lane violation, did some preventive officiating and then move on. Could this be deemed as a Technical Foul for being unsporting??? As also, to caveat the preventive officiating, the players went back to the coach and explain to him that we said, "They couldn't have their hands up at all? (JV Lads) Which left us to explain to the coach how they came to the understanding? It knicks me when the players have their own interpretation of what you said, "Which if they had it their way, it would turn into a...Did not; did too; did not...Does any of these situation s ever happen to any of you??????
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 09:33am
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Can't see myself calling a T. I think you did the right thing. Tell them not to do it. next time its a violation and we shoot the FT again if missed.
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 09:49am
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I would warn them, then start calling the lane violatons. If they do it ten times, so be it, I'm sure their coach will let them know when enough is enough. I can't picture myself calling a T either, and I don't have mine in front of me, but for some reason I think the rule book or the case book advises us to do just that. I think unless it is a major, obvious unsportsmanlike act, I would hold off on the T.
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 11:01am
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As for second aspect of your question, I would not pay mind to what players say to a coach coming off the court. However, if the coach asks what you called in response to their comments, I would just tell him you called a violation because they were waving their hands in a distracting manner. If he asks from the perspective of "you said XXX", I would simply say (in this case) "Coach, they can have their hands up, they can't wave them around" and leave it at that. You do not have to discuss what you did or didn't say, just explain your call and move on.
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 11:12am
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I should also have added that if it bothers you having players interpret things you say their own way, try coaching them
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 01:34pm
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Question: (While we're on this subject). Exactly where are the players' (occupying marked lane spaces) HANDS permitted to be? Rule 9.1.9 only addresses where their FEET are allowed to be. I did a girls' 8th grade game last season and the girls kept putting their arms out in front of their opponent positioned next to them. Twenty years ago when I played, we did this...but is it legal? Thanks for your response in advance (I'm a rookie).
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 11:04pm
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quote: Is there an official signal that goes with "coach being a jackass?" (My english teacher likes to mention jackass alarms, is that similar?)
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Wed Aug 09, 2000, 11:22pm
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Seems to me ... Arms need to be over the player's body, as on defense. If you are obstructing a player by reaching across, it technically is a foul, although a word of warning should be sufficient. We usually get the one-ups-manship, where A reaches across B, who then reaches in front of A's arm, who then reaches back in front of B until the ref gets tired of it and says "knock it off."
As for distracting shooter with late shouting, movement, etc. this has become very common, if unsporting. It also should have very little effect on the shooter, and I doubt they really notice it (unless we are talking younger ages). Shouting late has no excuse, as it could be done earlier, and would be better from a defensive standpoint if communication occurs early. Raising arms in preparation for a rebound or to get an advantage has more of an excuse, but still should have little impact on shot. Let it go unless it is clearly beyond the pale and intended as (and causes) a distraction. [This message has been edited by Hawks Coach (edited August 09, 2000).]
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Thu Aug 10, 2000, 12:42am
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Once I notice the yells from B1 to B2 just at the release, I find it effective on the next free throw to look directly at B1 while in the lane, and instruct him so all players can hear, to say whatever he needs to say to B2 now. As all players are looking at B1, I then ask, "are you done?" Peer pressure can be positive! Then I give the ball to A1.
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Thu Aug 10, 2000, 11:29am
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quote: Yes, there is. You put your two hands in the shape of a "T". Sometimes, you do it twice 
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Tue Aug 29, 2000, 02:26am
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There is if i'm not mistaken, a neutral zone that extends up from the edges of the marked lane space (an imaganary line)and that if a player crossed that line a violation could be called.(Like you really would but...) In any cass the new NCAA rule will help alot on this point.
About the waving of hands. We had a situation where one team would continually attempt to do this. The problem that we had wasn't exactly with the team it was with our members, different members called it or didn't. This allowed the team to accomplish there goals part of the time. (The coach new the rule and as soon as they were worned they would stop..untill the next game). We have already discussed this situation as a group and have indicated that it will be an immediate violation. Keep smiling [This message has been edited by hoopsrefBC (edited August 29, 2000).]
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