The Heinz 57 of evenings (Family size bottle)

[fletch_irwin_m]

Last nights games had a little bit of everything! Feel free to rate how these situations were handled.

1. Opening tip. B1 back tips to B2 who proceeds to shoot at the WRONG basket and is hammered. Ball goes OOB off A1. I blow the foul, but do not award two shots as he is shooting at the wrong basket.
2. This happened twice. Sharp pass under the backboard. SIT ONE: A1 passes the ball and the ball goes up to the cylinder from underneath but does not go all the way through, back down and into the hands of B1. SIT TWO: Everything the same except ball goes up and back down. SIT ONE: Nothing called SIT TWO: Dead ball, AP.
3. 12 players in book, 11 players on floor. 12th player shows up in the third period. He is allowed to play as he is in the book.
4. Player B1 fouls out. Coach uses all of his 30 seconds and does not put player in. Coach is told he needs to replace, does not. TWEET "T". Coach "I thought I had a minute?" We shoot the common foul bonus, followed by "T" with ball at division line.
5. .9 seconds left. B1 shooting 1 and 1. A1 and A2 underneath, B2 by A2. Shot is missed, A2 rebounds the ball on the block, turns, mugged by B2, whistle, horn. Coach A is screaming for 3 free throws as he felt it was a shot attempt. Partner and I huddle before we report anything and decide it was not a shot attmept and award the bonus. Team A down 2, player misses first of 1 and 1 game over.
6. (Wife's game) 14 seconds left her team is up 5. She uses her last TO to calm the players down and EMPHATICALLY says WE HAVE NO MORE TO's. So naturally they call a TO. "T" is given, free throws are shot (Missed 1 thankfully)then Visiting coach calls her last TO. This was fortunate for us as my wifes team was never given her TO. I thought, and I could be wrong, they would be granted the TO then the T's would be shot then ball at division line.
There were a few more things, but I do have some work to do. I think the sits were handled correctly, even called the 5th foul on BOTH star players!, but any insight would help.

[mplagrow]

1. A shot at the wrong basket is not considered a try. Ball is dead when the foul occurs, if the basket goes or not it's no good.
2. Agree.
3. Agree, he's in the book he's good.
4. Could've used preventative officiating in this situation and somehow avoided making that call, IMHO.
5. With that amount of time left, don't you almost have to assume that it's a shot attempt? Could it have been an intentional foul too?
6. The time out should be awarded when the T is given.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by fletch_irwin_m
Sharp pass under the backboard. A1 passes the ball and the ball goes up to the cylinder from underneath, goes up and back down. SIT TWO: Dead ball, AP.

If by "goes up and back down", you mean that the ball passed all the way through the basket from beneath, then this is a violation on whoever touched the ball last. It would not be an alternating possession unless you were unable to determine who touched it before it passed through the basket. If the ball went off A2's hands, then award the ball to B at a designated spot along the endline.

All the other situations sound right to me. Nice job.

Chuck

[Mregor]

1. Not a try because they are not shooting at their basket; correct, no free throws.
2. correct, if the ball passes through the cylinder it is a violation and the opposing team of the player that caused it to go through gets the ball for a throw in.
3. correct
4. correct
5. correct
6. Once time out granted the team is entitled to all benefits of the time out. Should have had the TO followed by administration of the Tech.

This is a years worth in one night. Looks like you got them all right.

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by mplagrow
4. Could've used preventative officiating in this situation and somehow avoided making that call, IMHO.

"Coach is told he needs to replace,..."

Isn't that preventative officiating? 30 seconds expired, coach was asked for a sub, (which isn't required), and he doesn't sub. Pretty clear T in my book.

5. With that amount of time left, don't you almost have to assume that it's a shot attempt? Could it have been an intentional foul too? [/QUOTE]

Why would you assume such and why would it matter? Make the call on what you see. Team A is down 2. When A2 misses the first shot, the game is over.



fletch, why was Coach A yelling for 3 shots?

[fletch_irwin_m]

It was not intentional, just trying to "D" up.
He wanted three shots since the "shot" was taken 70' away.
I give him an A for effort.

[mplagrow]

I guess I shouldn't say 'assume' it was a shot attempt. What I'm getting at is that as a coach, I would expect my players to take a shot with .9 left in the game, not make a pass. If I was a coach, I would be unhappy if my player tried to take that shot and got fouled, and WASN"T given the three free throws, because lets face it, I think a lot of refs would refuse to put someone on the line for three shots in that situation, right or wrong. Do you agree?

[BktBallRef]

It's black and white to me. If it's a shot, it's a shot.

[Rich]

A player gets a rebound, turns and gets contacted 70-75 feet from the basket.

It would be a cold day in you-know-where before I'd ever blow a whistle on this contact with .9 second on the clock. Anyone that would call this a shooting foul is sorely lacking in common sense. Me? I'm heading off the floor.

Rich

[mplagrow]

Yeah, but, but, but,. . . . . .

what if it IS a foul? I'm playing devil's advocate here.

[Adam]

Long time ago in a....
Got whistled for my 4th foul just before half time on a play like this in JH.
My take is that a player is stupid for fouling in this situation (I was) and the shots are warranted (if he's shooting). Chances of it going in are too small.

[mplagrow]

I agree. Any coach worth his salt will be telling his players, "Don't foul!" Why would he have to do this if the referees predetermined they wouldn't call a foul anyways? Now, I'll admit to biting my whistle a little bit at the end of a game, but IF the foul was called (and in this case it was), and IF the player is trying to shoot, albeit from 70 feet away, doesn't he deserve three throws?

[Rich]

I'm just saying it would have to be a knock-the-player-on-his-backside kinda foul before I'm calling it. And it would have to then be one heckuva clear shot attempt before it's a shooting foul. Odds of both of these happening are about zero.

Besides, as soon as the ball is touched in the backcourt with .9 second left, I'm tucking the whistle and finding the exit

Rich

[fletch_irwin_m]

Rich,
I am usually the one on this board being harranged for stuff like "I am not blowing my whislte". After all a fouls is a foul no matter WHEN it occurs I am told. Where are all the people who jump on my case? It must just be me!!
ANYWAYS, this was pretty obvious foul. No way NOT to call it. But I do agree that giving him 3 shots is not appropriate. This guy just pivoted cocked the arm back and then was "Sacked" by the Inside line backer, I mean the opposing player. In my judgement, had he taken a dribble to clear or tried the release with two hands or the "running" one hander I would have given him the 3 shots. With his other team mates screaming for the ball and no clear attempt to do anything other then heave the ball there is no shot, regardless of time.

[Rich]

"See a foul, call a foul" is an easy thing to say on an Internet message board.

I just don't think it's that simple in real life.

Rich