Asking for officiating evaluation from coach

DownTownTonyBrown · #1 (**permalink**) Mon Jan 20, 2003, 03:34pm

I had asked this question in the middle of another thread but let me start a new thread.

Honestly, I have considered asking coaches their opinion in private, AFTER the game... days after. But haven't done it.

Has anyone discussed their officiating style with a coach - one-on-one, away from the game? What were your results? Good experience? Improved your game? Compassion for coaches position? Bad experience; don't do it? Great value; no value - they are as oblivious as we thought?

No offense intended coaches.

ChuckElias · #2 (**permalink**) Mon Jan 20, 2003, 03:39pm

Just as most officials don't have any idea of what a coach has to do to coach a good game, most coaches have no idea of what it means or what it takes to officiate a good game. The coach's opinion doesn't mean much unless that coach is also an accomplished official. Honestly, I wouldn't seek out his/her opinion.

If you believe a coach when he says you did a good job, you have to believe him when he says you sucked.

Chuck

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. · #3 (**permalink**) Mon Jan 20, 2003, 03:57pm

Quote:

Originally posted by ChuckElias
Just as most officials don't have any idea of what a coach has to do to coach a good game, most coaches have no idea of what it means or what it takes to officiate a good game. The coach's opinion doesn't mean much unless that coach is also an accomplished official. Honestly, I wouldn't seek out his/her opinion.

If you believe a coach when he says you did a good job, you have to believe him when he says you sucked.

Chuck

Chuck,

I am giving you the kiss of death today, for the second time today I have seconded your opinion. You hit the nail on the head.

w_sohl · #4 (**permalink**) Mon Jan 20, 2003, 04:06pm

Quote:

Originally posted by ChuckElias
Just as most officials don't have any idea of what a coach has to do to coach a good game, most coaches have no idea of what it means or what it takes to officiate a good game. The coach's opinion doesn't mean much unless that coach is also an accomplished official. Honestly, I wouldn't seek out his/her opinion.

If you believe a coach when he says you did a good job, you have to believe him when he says you sucked.

Chuck

This is my point exactly in Illinois where coaches ratings are part of what is used to evaluate an official for promotion. It is the most ridicioulous thing I have experienced as an official. Gotta deal with it though if I want to advance...

CYO Butch · #5 (**permalink**) Mon Jan 20, 2003, 04:24pm

Civil coaches do exit, and those are the only ones you should consider talking to. That means you won't be talking to the ones that tell you that you sucked. I consider myself very civil, and I know a lot of other civil coaches. As a coach, I always try to make sure that I thank the officials at the end of the game. I will thank them even if I thought one or both of them did a weak job. But, I will compliment them if I think they handled something exceptionally well, and apologize if I had started any howling. I will not offer advice on officiating, but I might make a commiserating comment to one of them if their partner was having a rough game. If an official ever approached me outside the context of a game just played, I would be happy, but a little surprised

. If asked for advice, the first thing I'd probably tell them would be to check out http://officialforum.com/

.

JRutledge · #6 (**permalink**) Mon Jan 20, 2003, 05:27pm

Quote:

Originally posted by w_sohl

This is my point exactly in Illinois where coaches ratings are part of what is used to evaluate an official for promotion. It is the most ridicioulous thing I have experienced as an official. Gotta deal with it though if I want to advance...

But in the situation that you talk about, I have known officials be the bigger jerks in this promotion process than the coaches or schools. You do not have to have the coaches rate you at all in this process. You could have an AD, a Principle or anyone that might be more objective to this process. Usually the coaches have no problem giving officials a favorable rating to promote guys. And just like anything, you ask those that look at you move favorable than those that hate your guts. And if you cannot find 3 schools to give you a favorable rating, maybe you need to stop officiating all together. Someone should think you deserve a opportunity to move up.

Peace

LepTalBldgs · #7 (**permalink**) Tue Jan 21, 2003, 11:38am

As a first year official I have often wondered about the opportunity to get feedback from coaches whom I thought coached a good game. Each time I have decided not to for the reasons stated above.

I'm pretty sure I will not ever seek feedback from a coach but from officials I respect.

twoblindrefs · #8 (**permalink**) Tue Jan 21, 2003, 03:29pm

How about asking a veteran ref you respect observe you....

IN OTHER WORDS, FIND A MENTOR!!!

I remember starting out working the freshman/jv 2 game set and then sitting in the locker room for some of the "varsity pre-game" then going out and watching the 1st half of the varsity game.....

Then, with the OK of the two officials, bothering the varsity refs some more about certain things I saw in the 1st half.

Asking a coach will not get you good answers as directly, most won't give you the info you are looking for....trust me, as a Coordinator, i have a tough time getting it on the officials I send to them!

Hawks Coach · #9 (**permalink**) Tue Jan 21, 2003, 05:11pm

You don't want to ask me how you've done in one of my games. Responses could vary all over the place, from a patronizing you did great (don't want to make an enemy of the refs no do we?) to a litany of what you missed. We all coach this game with biases, and these will often come out when you ask that type of question.

Now on the other hand, I will give feedback to refs that I think do a good job based on what I see that I like in how they run a game, if the opportunity presents itself. I don't give negative feedback, because my experience is that refs don't want to hear it from a coach. I am not going to do psychology experiments to see who will and will not listen. And they are right to take my words with a grain of salt as a very biased participant in a competition.

Bart Tyson · #10 (**permalink**) Tue Jan 21, 2003, 05:34pm

Not a good idea. Coaches don't have a clue.

canuckrefguy · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Jan 21, 2003, 05:47pm

Some coaches will give you honest, good, useful answers, but for most it's a crapshoot, so it's really not worth it, unless you REALLY know the coaches well.

Unfortunately, Bart's right...while I wouldn't say most coaches have NO clue, they can't really help officials with the feedback they really need.

More experienced officials are your best source of information.

However, if you just HAVE to have input from coaches, maybe ask your assignor. A lot of assignors keep tabs on things, especially at the College/Varsity/JV level - soliciting bits and pieces from various coaches on various officials.

But mainly, you should be approaching the vets in your association for feedback. It's their responsibility to help the up-and-comers who are proactive enough to seek it.

whistleone · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Jan 21, 2003, 05:56pm

My recommendation would be that if you have a good relationship with a coach, feel free to ask for comments. If it's the first game you've worked for a school, don't even worry about asking for an opinion.

At our district "camp" over the summer, we had a coach talk about what he sees as things officials could do better. Most of it was game management stuff. Off season is a great time to pick a coach's brain.

A coach could give valuable feedback about how a certain call changed the game or how the players perceived the game. These are things that officials may not pick up on or be able to get from other observers.

baldy1 · #13 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 22, 2003, 08:33am

I would never ask a coach you are asking for trouble and plenty of it. Find a veteren who will be honest and fair and ask them to evaluate you. The coach is out there for one thing and that is to win. Most coaches have no clue on officiating (they shouldn't have to it is not there job.)