Backcourt Violation-per NCAA

[kmref]

Memo by the NCAA women's basketball:

Front Court/Back Court.

Play: Team A has the ball in their frontcourt. A1 passes the ball to A2. As the pass heads toward the back court, A2 jumps into the air, catches the ball and throws it toward the front court before landing in the back court. The ball bounces on the center line and into the front court before it is caught by A3 in the front court.

Ruling: This is a backcourt violation. Even though A2 is considered to be in the frontcourt when she touches the ball, because she left from the frontcourt, she caused the ball to go into the backcourt when it touched the center line. Rule 9-11.1 and 4-28.3.a & b.


Play: Team A has the ball in their frontcourt. A1 passes the ball to A2. The ball is passed in such a way that it bounces on the center line and then goes into the frontcourt where A2 catches it.

Ruling: This is a backcourt violation. A1 caused the ball to go into the backcourt when the pass she threw touched the center line.


There were threads in the pass couple of weeks regarding this particular situation.
To see the memo: http://www.ncaa.org/champadmin/baske...etins/2002-03.

[mick]

Originally posted by kmref
Memo by the NCAA women's basketball:

Front Court/Back Court.

Play: Team A has the ball in their frontcourt. A1 passes the ball to A2. As the pass heads toward the back court, A2 jumps into the air, catches the ball and throws it toward the front court before landing in the back court. The ball bounces on the center line and into the front court before it is caught by A3 in the front court.

Ruling: This is a backcourt violation. Even though A2 is considered to be in the frontcourt when she touches the ball, because she left from the frontcourt, she caused the ball to go into the backcourt when it touched the center line. Rule 9-11.1 and 4-28.3.a & b.


Play: Team A has the ball in their frontcourt. A1 passes the ball to A2. The ball is passed in such a way that it bounces on the center line and then goes into the frontcourt where A2 catches it.

Ruling: This is a backcourt violation. A1 caused the ball to go into the backcourt when the pass she threw touched the center line.


There were threads in the pass couple of weeks regarding this particular situation.
To see the memo: http://www.ncaa.org/champadmin/baske...etins/2002-03.

kmref,
Very clear, but I don't have to like it.
I think :Ball location is where a player touches it and
Player location is where the player is.
I think the ruling is flawed.
...But I'll call it the way it is written.
mick

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by mick

kmref,
Very clear, but I don't have to like it.
I think :Ball location is where a player touches it and
Player location is where the player is.
I think the ruling is flawed.
...But I'll call it the way it is written.
mick

Mick,

A was the last to touch before the ball went BC from the FC, A was the first to touch thereafter.
What's not to agree with?

[mick]

Originally posted by Dan_ref

Mick,

A was the last to touch before the ball went BC from the FC, A was the first to touch thereafter.
What's not to agree with?

Because Dan,

If a ball bounces from the front court and touches a player in the back court, the ball is in the back court where the player is.

Per the rulings I question:
If the ball bounces from the back court and touches a player in the front court, the ball is still considered to be in the back court where the player is not.

Doesn't feel right.

mick

[Hawks Coach]

I too am mystified by your confusion on this call Mick. This looks like a text book violation. Remember, it is not where the ball is presently, it is the fact that the ball ever hit in the backcourt that causes the violation.

Say that A1 throws a bad pass from an area near the baseline. The pass goes over the head of A2 causing A2 to run desparately and jump across the centerline in an attempt to save a ball from going backcourt (i.e, the ball is going straight toward the backcourt and A2 must save it). A2's attempted save lands in the backcourt (not just on the line), then bounces back into the frontcourt, where A3 picks it up.

This is most certainly a backcourt violation. These cases essentially state the same thing. A had team control, ball was front court, A was last to touch before it went backcourt, and first to touch after it went backcourt.

The squirrely play where A1 throws the ball from the backcourt to the front court, it hits an official and bounces backcourt, then A2 catches it in the backcourt is just the opposite variation of this theme, and it is specifically addressed in case #4.4.4.

4.4.4 SITUATION: The official is in Team A’s frontcourt when he/she is contacted by a pass thrown by A1 from Team A’s backcourt. After touching the official, the ball. . . (b) rebounds to the backcourt where it is recovered by A2. Ruling: Touching the official is the same as touching the floor where the official is standing. . . In (b), the ball has been in the frontcourt and then has gone to the backcourt while in Team A’s control. It is a violation for A1 to cause the ball to go from A’s backcourt to frontcourt and return to backcourt untouched if A1 or a teammate is first to touch it after it has returned to backcourt. (9-9-2)

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by mick
Because Dan,

If a ball bounces from the front court and touches a player in the back court, the ball is in the back court where the player is.

Per the rulings I question:
If the ball bounces from the back court and touches a player in the front court, the ball is still considered to be in the back court where the player is not.

Doesn't feel right.

mick

NCAA 9-11-1

A player shall not be the first to touch the ball in his/her back court when the ball came from the front court while the player's team was in control and the player or a teammate caused the ball to go into the back court.

It seems to me the wording could be clearer but I don't read it such that the player hmself is required to be in the back court, just the ball. Similar sitch: A1 in the FC by the division line fumbles the ball into the back court and then touches it without leaving the FC. BC violation, no?

Another twist... What if in the original play the ball bounces twice, once in the BC & once in the FC before A2 grabs it?

[MN 3 Sport Ref]

Didn't we get this straightened out very clearly on the last thread we had about this???

The ruling is there it is up to the official and his concience on how to enforce it....Is it enough just because we do not like a rule to not enforce it???

Regional differences may elasticate the steadfastness in which a rule is enforced, but that does not allow us to abandon it altogether.

[mick]

4-4-1: A ball which is in contact with a player or with the court is in the BC if either the ball or the player is touching the BC.
4-4-2: A ball which is in contact with a player is in the front court if neither the ball nor the player is touching the BC.
4-4-4: A ball which touches a player or an official is the same as the ball touching the floor at that individual's location.

9-9-1 A player...be the first to touch a ball (Anywhere on the court. Anywhere at all on the court.. FC BC ...Anywhere!) after in FC... then BC....

Duh-huh!
Got it.
Thanks, fellas.

mick

[mick]

Originally posted by MN 3 Sport Ref
Is it enough just because we do not like a rule to not enforce it???

Did I say that?
Did I imply that?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by MN 3 Sport Ref

Regional differences may elasticate the steadfastness in which a rule is enforced, but that does not allow us to abandon it altogether.

You are now,officially,my hero!

Can I borrow that for use on coaches?

[Hawks Coach]

No mick, you clearly said you would enforce, and implied that it leaves a bad taste in your mouth. Blow the whistle, but don't get your breath freshener of choice stuck in it

[mick]

Originally posted by Hawks Coach
No mick, you clearly said you would enforce, and implied that it leaves a bad taste in your mouth. Blow the whistle, but don't get your breath freshener of choice stuck in it

Hawks Coach,
I'm okay now.
When I blow the whistle, I'll be very a-Certs-ive.
mick

[dhodges007]

Originally posted by mick

Hawks Coach,
I'm okay now.
When I blow the whistle, I'll be very a-Certs-ive.
mick

Very funny...

[MN 3 Sport Ref]

Originally posted by mick

Did I say that?
Did I imply that?

Mick:

No intent to implicate you or imply that you were saying this. I was just making a blanket statement on how I believe we should officiate. No backstabbing intended