While I think the defender in question embellished the contact some, I believe there's definitely enough contact that you have to put air in the whistle.

Not as obvious an intentional foul as I was expecting based on all the chatter here. Have no problem if they had come together and gone with IF but seeing the play at normal speed the first time I thought the player initially made a play on the ball. Further scrutiny leads to going IF but I can understand how the officials didn't go with an IF at the moment.

I have no idea who's idea it was to lump all discussions about the games into one thread but it is a horrible idea. It is nearly impossible to tell which comments go with which play at this point.

And that is the way, if we're going to lump all of these into one discussion, to reference the plays.

121...defender slid under late, still moving sideways after the shooter was airborne and the contact was largely on the leading shoulder...block.

123...defender also late, block....the defender was not in the path at the moment the shooter left the floor...his torso continued to move laterally another 1-2 feet after the shooter jumped and before contact.

139...travel, 2 times....but the contact looked like a charge....except for the constant hand on shooter throughout the play.

148...Intentional foul....no attempt at the ball whatsoever.

I respect that, but I have yet to see a legitimate play on the ball. What I do see clearly is an airborne player being grabbed as he's trying to bang one home.

In regards to your "at the moment" comment, I guess time & score does factor in at what we do...

While they may be case in some plays that's not what I meant this time. I meant if my first look at the play I felt like the defender may a legit play on the ball I can see how at that moment the officials on the court thought the same.

I agree that after reviewing the play we have an IF.

Actually I think the first action was to slap at the ball. The other arm was around him, but the foul was on the shooting arm. And no this is not an area thing, this is a judgment thing. I probably call more Intentional Fouls than many people here or in my area, and I call the first action, not the second action or action that did not affect the play. If we call what a player does second a lot, then you will have intentional fouls in almost every end of game situation.

I would rather error on the side of not calling an intentional in this case where it is not "obvious" to everyone then call one that we have to debate.

Peace

This is what I saw initially also. That's why in the other thread I was surprised not to see an OBVIOUS intentional foul the first time I watched the play after reading about it.

Not even sure if there was any contact on the arm. The grab around the waist is what stopped the shot.

The official in question had a much better angle on the entire play than we did. So what stopped the shot or not is based on one angle and the angle the official did not have.

Peace

Really?! I'll agree that he had a "different" angle, but he hardly had a "better" angle! He was chasing the play down & actually was straightlined when the defender wrapped him with the right arm.

I don't know about you, but I make more CC when I receive the play as opposed to chasing them down.

My point about this particular play is that, time & score obviously matter because the same play at the end of the game or after a hard foul would result in a discussion on double whistles, at the very least.

IMO, the C had the best look, but the L gave him the look like, "I got it, I got it!"

I think lead had a decent look but the C had the best look at the play, and they both didn't have an intentional even after getting together.

The right arm went for the ball. ;)

Well that was the angle he had and unlike you or me he did not have multiple replays to break down the play. He and his partners had one shot.

Maybe, but that is not how many calls are made in my experience. And certainly not on a quick steal and going to the other end of the court. Sorry, I would not use that as an excuse to get a play right or not in this situation.

OK, but that does not mean everyone agrees with that. You can state what you would have done all day long, it was not your call or my call. Easy to sit on my couch and tell others what you would have done or who had the best angle. :)

Peace

Grab the travel first so that you don't end up calling what should have been a PC foul, a block by mistake.

They sure didn't.

Peace