3-whistle coverage in transition

[ChuckElias]

Situation: Long rebound results in a fast break the other way. The players are basically 1-on-1. The drive to the basket begins on the Center's (or Slot's) side of the floor. There is contact on the low block on the Center's side of the lane.

Question: Who should have a whistle on this? Who should have the first whistle?

In this situation, where I am the Lead and the play clearly originates on the C's side of the floor and the contact is on the C's side of the floor, it is always my habit NOT to have a whistle unless one of the players gets killed. In my mind, that's the C's (or Slot's) call all the way. I mean, that's why we have a center official, right?

But at my last scrimmage, we had the above scenario occur. Observer told me that in a 1-on-1 in transition, the Lead should just take the call, even if it's the first whistle. Treat it as Lead's primary in this particular situation. This advice came from a very very good D1 NCAA official (has even worked the tournament). But I don't like the advice, so I would just like to hear the consensus of people who work 3-whistle. Any thoughts?

Chuck

[BktBallRef]

If the lead is in position and the C is still on the run, I'd take your friend's advice.

If both are in position, I'm swallowing at lead.

Perhaps his concern was that the C was not in position?

[Dan_ref]

Chuck, with your speed I know you were ahead of this play
and could treat this as normal coverage. But some folks
can't treat this as normal coverage because they're just
in front of the play or they've stopped at the FT line
to see what happens. In any case, I'm thinking unless
you've clearly beaten the break & are in position why would
the L not take this play? Did your observer say anything
about this or double whistles on the break?

[Tim Roden]

My question is who had the better view between the players? Coming from the C's side of the floor is a good formula for being straight lined by either official. If L is a little slow getting down the floor, he can get a good look between the players and get the whistle. If we do have the double whistle, I am taking it as C if it is on my half of the floor. I won't swallow my whistle as L. A double whistle is always good in this situation. I disagree with holding your whistle if it isn't very far out of your primary. In transition, the areas are not well defined as they are in a half court offense.

[JRutledge]

There really is no rigid coverage area in transition. The Lead can get help from the C and the C can get help from the Lead. The Lead might have a better angle based on the type of play or the C might have a much better look. Both officials could have a whistle, just get the call right. Once in frontcourt coverage you can go back to the rigid coverage areas. But the C position is designed to "help out" if you will. I guess you could say the Lead has the first crack at the call, but the C can make a call if the Lead misses something.

Peace

[Nevadaref]

In our HS 4A varsity games, both boys and girls, we use three officials all season, so even though I don't officiate NCAA games, (but hopefully will someday) I have plenty of 3-man games under my belt.
My belief is that you are right. That is the C's call. The schools are paying for a third official and he should hustle down the court and get his butt in position to make the call.
However, in practice this doesn't always happen. The C could get caught behind some players or watching a trap near half court, or just plain be lazy. In those cases, I have, and will continue to make the call from the lead when necessary as your experienced friend advises.
I know there is this stupid pressure from evaluators and assignors that we have to be accountable to and hence try to please because they control who gets games, but when the day is done, in my heart, I would rather know that we got the play right, even if it costs me an assignment or two in the future.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by Dan_ref
unless you've clearly beaten the break & are in position why would the L not take this play? Did your observer say anything about this or double whistles on the break?

I was in front of the play, that's true. And if this had been a 2-man game, I would have had no problem with taking the call.

I've just always thought that if the play starts with the C, the C takes it all the way. So I wanted to get other opinions.

Chuck

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by ChuckElias


I've just always thought that if the play starts with the C, the C takes it all the way. So I wanted to get other opinions.

Chuck [/B]

That is absolutely correct...however, the L does have the opportunity to help out...as was stated before, if the C hasn't gotten down there yet, take it and sell it hard... if the C is down there, lay off the whistle - unless it's one of those "Oh my God" types of fouls...

From the 2002-03 CCA Women's manual (may be different in men's manual): "During a fast break in transition...in one-on-one situations, with the play originating in C's area and a foul committed on the drive to the basket, C makes the call." If this is a double whistle situation, the C needs to take ownership of the call and take it to the table...

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by ChuckElias
I've just always thought that if the play starts with the C, the C takes it all the way. So I wanted to get other opinions.

True, but in your situation, it sounds like the C didn't have it, so the L needs to take the call. I know when I'm at C, I'll often stay back on a fast break to clean up players, or I'll simply get beat because I was a bit too close to the other endline.

[Z REF]

I have never had a college supervisor instruct me to get that call from the lead. Any collegiate official who is consistently "beat" on that play at C probably won't be in that conference for too long.

Having said that, if there was definite, meaningful contact that created a disadvantage for A, and C for whatever reason didn't get it, then L could step in...but the first whistle?

But this guy is on TV, and I've seen the boys on TV do some strange things that aren't taught in camps or jamborees...so...when in Rome...

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Z REF

But this guy is on TV, and I've seen the boys on TV do some strange things that aren't taught in camps or jamborees...so...when in Rome...

You will find that the officials on TV have a certain credibility that we do not have. And even the officials that have been around have credibility that those that are just breaking in. No different than doing a HS game with a 20+ year veteran that has done the State Finals. Once you have reached a certain level of achievement, you will be given a pass or be allowed to do things that get the call right. No different in any part of life. Think of it this way, when we get to a certain level, we will get to tell the younger officials what is right and wrong. I guess it all goes in a circle.

Peace

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by Mark Dexter
in your situation, it sounds like the C didn't have it, so the L needs to take the call.

Just to clarify the sitch, the C did make the call. In discussing the play later, I mentioned that I laid off the whistle intentionally to give C first crack. That's when the observer said that I should not hold off, and just treat it as my primary.

Chuck

[heyref32]

Transition on a break is our hardest play to referee because we are moving quickly to get into position, as we are running our eyes are moving up and down with our bodies unlike when we are standing still. As T going to new L on a quick transition and you see the whole play call it and take the guess work out of whether or not your C is there to get it. A double whistle would be ideal. I treat the new L coverage in a fast break situation almost like the C position in transition where the C can officiate all the way to the far sideline. That is how I have been taught, it takes the guess work out of the equation by wondering wether or not the C's got it.

[mick]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

Just to clarify the sitch, the C did make the call. In discussing the play later, I mentioned that I laid off the whistle intentionally to give C first crack. That's when the observer said that I should not hold off, and just treat it as my primary.

Chuck

Chuck,
All of this makes sense.
So, ... from Lead, we see it, we blow it.
Double whistle? Give it back to C and let 'im report it.
mick

[ChuckElias]

yU.P. mick, that's how it looks from here too. Guess I'll put that one in the ol' pre-game binder.

Chuck