butt ball

[rsl]

A player jumps and tries to make behind the back pass off the dribble, and ends up planting the ball squarely on his butt. As he lands, he drops the ball and then recovers it.

Is this a violation?

I called travel because the ball never left his hand and his pivot foot returned to the floor.

But, he did momentarily loose control when he essentially blocked his own pass with his backside, so now I am wondering.

[Camron Rust]

Travel. While he didn't have general purpose control of what he was trying to do, he did have "player control" since the ball never left his hand(s).

[SamIAm]

Originally Posted by rsl

A player jumps and tries to make behind the back pass off the dribble, and ends up planting the ball squarely on his butt. As he lands, he drops the ball and then recovers it.

Is this a violation?

I called travel because the ball never left his hand and his pivot foot returned to the floor.

But, he did momentarily loose control when he essentially blocked his own pass with his backside, so now I am wondering.

When did the dribble end, before or after he jumped?

[bob jenkins]

I read it as a fumble, but I think a better description of the timing would help.

[rsl]

Originally Posted by SamIAm

When did the dribble end, before or after he jumped?

The attempted pass came off the dribble, just before he jumped. The return to the floor is what caused the ball to come loose.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by rsl

The attempted pass came off the dribble, just before he jumped. The return to the floor is what caused the ball to come loose.

Yabut.....

You can pass without ending a dribble.

We still don't know if/when the dribble ended. That info is needed to give a definitive answer.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by rsl

The attempted pass came off the dribble, just before he jumped. The return to the floor is what caused the ball to come loose.

Well then, the ground can't cause a fumble.

First Down!

[JRutledge]

I got nothing until I get more information.

Peace

[rsl]

I gotta admit, I don't know when the dribble ended.

Ball bounces up and contacts hand, he jumps. At that point he could still push the ball back down, but instead whips the ball around his back for the pass and pins it on his back. Then he lands, and the ball falls to the floor, he turns around and grabs it.

Given that I can't say when the dribble ended, JRut is probably right- I should have had nothing.

How does that saying go- Just 'cause it looks funny doesn't mean it is illegal.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by rsl

I gotta admit, I don't know when the dribble ended.

Ball bounces up and contacts hand, he jumps. At that point he could still push the ball back down, but instead whips the ball around his back for the pass and pins it on his back.

Dribble might end here.

Then he lands,

allowable

[quote and the ball falls to the floor,[/quote]

fumble

he turns around and grabs it.

Allowed to recover fumble.

[rsl]

Thanks!

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Well then, the ground can't cause a fumble.

No, but it can cause an incomplete pass.

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

No, but it can cause an incomplete pass.

In football the ground can cause fumbles.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Well then, the ground can't cause a fumble.

First Down!

Yes it can.

It seems to me the dribble ended when it was pinned to the player's back.

[johnsonboys03]

even tho it looked bad I would say it is no more than a jump stop. Even if he jumps and lands on two feet its not a violation. Lands on both feet he just can't use a pivot. If he landed one foot then the other the first to hit the floor is the pivot. It sounds like an ugly play that the fans would scream about if you didn't call it but it wasn't anything more than an ugly legal play. But then again had to see it to really know.