Delay of Game Situation

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

That implies there's a correct side, one which is easier and leads to a better day-long mood. Hmmm.

Well, somebody got out of bed on the logic-chopping side, I see.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Well, somebody got out of bed on the logic-chopping side, I see.

That implies that there is an illogical....never mind.

Oh and delay of game warning to Snaqs.

[bainsey]

Play nice, boys.

Hey Snaq, when you say that item four is "the only one where it matters," does "it" = intent? If so, wouldn't item one require intent, too?

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Welpe

I had a situation come up during a varsity scrimmage that I'd like to run by the collective wisdom of the forum.

Two fast breaking teams with about two minutes left in the period, score is not all that close. A15 goes up for a successful lay up and on the way down, puts up his hand which the ball deflects off of and squirts away down the end line a few feet.

In my judgment, A15 did this as a reaction to keep the ball from hitting him in the face and did not intentionally interfere with the ball. Based upon the reaction of the defense, I don't think it interefered with a fast break opportunity either.

The head coach for the defense was incensed and did not care for my explanation after the the period had ended. He wanted to the delay of game called and said it did not matter if the player was protecting himself or not.

What do you all think? Does he have a valid argument? Do you make any allowance for a player protecting himself in a situation like that?

Incidentally, a three hour scrimmage with three teams and only two officials is not a lot of fun but we got a lot of reps in.

No valid argument. Of course one gets an allowance to prevent the ball from hitting them in the face. You could tell the coach that you'll be more diligent on stopping the clock to allow his team to gather the ball, but you won't penalize a team to prevent a ball from hitting a face.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Play nice, boys.

Hey Snaq, when you say that item four is "the only one where it matters," does "it" = intent? If so, wouldn't item one require intent, too?

Yes.

Not really, because if you see a huddle, you can assume intent, IMO.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

That implies there's a correct side, one which is easier and leads to a better day-long mood. Hmmm.

The correct side is the one that isn't against a bedroom wall.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The correct side is the one that isn't against a bedroom wall.

The correct side is the side that has been assigned to me by the boss.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

The correct side is the side that has been assigned to me by the boss.

LOL

Anyway, looking at the four again...

1. Players don't huddle accidentally. = intent
2. Water doesn't get spilled deliberately. = usually no intent, though this rule came from an intentional, sneaky nature
3. Defenders rarely cross the plane deliberately. = no intent/usually reckless
4. Hitting the ball may be the only one where it matters. = intent

I generally agree with the breakdown, but it can't be the "only one that matters" if there's intent involved in the huddle too, right?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bainsey

LOL

Anyway, looking at the four again...

1. Players don't huddle accidentally. = intent
2. Water doesn't get spilled deliberately. = usually no intent, though this rule came from an intentional, sneaky nature
3. Defenders rarely cross the plane deliberately. = no intent/usually reckless
4. Hitting the ball may be the only one where it matters. = intent

I generally agree with the breakdown, but it can't be the "only one that matters" if there's intent involved in the huddle too, right?

I think he was saying that #4 is the only one where you need to determine intent.

It's either assumed or not needed in the others.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bainsey

LOL

Anyway, looking at the four again...

1. Players don't huddle accidentally. = intent
2. Water doesn't get spilled deliberately. = usually no intent, though this rule came from an intentional, sneaky nature
3. Defenders rarely cross the plane deliberately. = no intent/usually reckless
4. Hitting the ball may be the only one where it matters. = intent

I generally agree with the breakdown, but it can't be the "only one that matters" if there's intent involved in the huddle too, right?

It doesn't "matter" if it's never absent. The only one of the four where intent is both required and potentially absent is #4.
1. I've never seen them huddle by accident, so it's not relevant in practice.
2. Water on the floor will get penalized regardless of intent; it could be accidental or it could be intentional. Doesn't matter.
3. Same as #2. It's usually an accident, but occasionally it's intentional. Either way, unless there's less than 5 seconds on a running clock, you penalize it.
4. Can happen by accident or intent, but typically only penalized when there is inent. Note, the player may hit the ball in an attempt to be helpful, but if he purposefully hits the ball and it delays the throw-in; violation.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

The correct side is the side that has been assigned to me by the boss.

The boss has both sides here. I've been banished from the Queendom because of my sleeping habits.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by jurassic referee

the boss has both sides here. I've been banished from the queendom because of my sleeping habits.

tmi.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The boss has both sides here. I've been banished from the Queendom because of my sleeping habits.

The boss here has graciously given me fully one half of the that I may inhabit as I see fit. It seemed fair at the time. Too bad I didn't realize sooner the implications of her keeping the top half for herself.

[Adam]

My boss has been known to change sides in the middle of the night.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

It doesn't "matter" if it's never absent. The only one of the four where intent is both required and potentially absent is #4.

Got it. As BJ figured out, you were talking about determination. Thanks.