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-   -   Alternating Possession Question NFHS (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/59674-alternating-possession-question-nfhs.html)

Back In The Saddle Wed Nov 10, 2010 07:28pm

Yes, it is possible to have a double foul involving an airborne shooter. It is also possible to have a false double foul involving an airborne shooter.

CDurham Wed Nov 10, 2010 09:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoochy (Post 700388)
Is a Blarge a double foul?:D

Yes. In my DI scrimmage last Saturday we had the Trail go straight into the player control foul and going the other way. The Lead on the other hand has a foul but doesnt give his signal, but he has a block (I know this is different than both giving signals). The Lead gets with the Trail and they decide to with the Trails call. The Lead was the referee and seemed like he wanted to go with his foul, but thought otherwise and since the Trail gave his signal we went with his.

It was a great Blarge administration experience.

just another ref Wed Nov 10, 2010 09:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDurham (Post 700435)
Yes. In my DI scrimmage last Saturday we had the Trail go straight into the player control foul and going the other way. The Lead on the other hand has a foul but doesnt give his signal, but he has a block (I know this is different than both giving signals). The Lead gets with the Trail and they decide to with the Trails call. The Lead was the referee and seemed like he wanted to go with his foul, but thought otherwise and since the Trail gave his signal we went with his.

Why?

CDurham Wed Nov 10, 2010 09:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 700443)
Why?

Well if you have 2 giving signals then everyone has seen it and you have no choice to go with the Double. But if only 1 has given their signal then you have a chance to just penalize theirs if the other official agress, rather than going with the Double in the instance of both giving their signal.

I meant to say that this situation is different than both officials giving their preliminary signals, because only 1 gave theirs in my scrimmage.

just another ref Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDurham (Post 700445)
Well if you have 2 giving signals then everyone has seen it and you have no choice to go with the Double. But if only 1 has given their signal then you have a chance to just penalize theirs if the other official agress, rather than going with the Double in the instance of both giving their signal.

And all this is based on what?

Adam Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:11am

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 700464)
And all this is based on what?

You know very well what he's basing it on; and you're the only one who disagrees on the meaning.

just another ref Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:30am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 700483)
You know very well what he's basing it on; and you're the only one who disagrees on the meaning.

New guy in the discussion, as far as I know. He says he knows it's different if both give preliminary signals. I want to know how he knows this, since it's not written anywhere. He also refers to the officials agreeing on the one call if only one prelim is given. This implies that they had a discussion. (Is this true?) I thought the consensus here was that discussion was not allowed.

Adam Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:53am

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 700488)
New guy in the discussion, as far as I know. He says he knows it's different if both give preliminary signals. I want to know how he knows this, since it's not written anywhere. He also refers to the officials agreeing on the one call if only one prelim is given. This implies that they had a discussion. (Is this true?) I thought the consensus here was that discussion was not allowed.

Discussion is allowed, even required, but the result is pre-ordained by the case play.

just another ref Thu Nov 11, 2010 01:11am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 700493)
Discussion is allowed, even required, but the result is pre-ordained by the case play.

How many preliminary signals were given in the case play?

Adam Thu Nov 11, 2010 01:26am

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 700494)
How many preliminary signals were given in the case play?

You can ask all the rhetorical questions you want, Socrates, but the fact remains 99.999% of officials, including those with ties to the rules committee, that we've talked to agree that when the case play says "call," it means "signal."

Good night.

just another ref Thu Nov 11, 2010 01:32am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 700495)
You can ask all the rhetorical questions you want, Socrates, but the fact remains 99.999% of officials, including those with ties to the rules committee, that we've talked to agree that when the case play says "call," it means "signal."

In most cases this is true. But is this not also more or less universally accepted:

While one official may not overrule another official's call, he may share information with that official which may convince him to change his own call.

mbyron Thu Nov 11, 2010 06:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 700495)
You can ask all the rhetorical questions you want, Socrates. . .

Let's not confuse JAR's stubborn unwillingness to accept legitimate authority (on this point) with a Socratic attempt to deflate illegitimate claims to knowledge.

Jurassic Referee Thu Nov 11, 2010 06:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 700500)
Let's not confuse JAR's stubborn unwillingness to accept legitimate authority (on this point) with a Socratic attempt to deflate illegitimate claims to knowledge.

Agree. Assign it where it really belongs. Sheer stoopidity.

mbyron Thu Nov 11, 2010 06:30am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 700504)
Agree. Assign it where it really belongs. Sheer stoopidity.

Well, I didn't want to go there because the vast majority of his posts are spot on. Just this one point seems to stick for him. I confess it seems a little odd to me.

CDurham Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 700495)
You can ask all the rhetorical questions you want, Socrates, but the fact remains 99.999% of officials, including those with ties to the rules committee, that we've talked to agree that when the case play says "call," it means "signal."

Good night.

What did I start here? Is my wording or situation not correct?


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