kansas vs. UNI illegal substitution?

[KCRC]

Originally Posted by alillard88

Per the NCAA Rule Book (Rule 3, Section 4, Article 13)

Art. 13. A player who has been withdrawn or replaced by a substitute may re-enter
the game at the next opportunity to substitute, provided that the game clock has been
properly started after the withdrawal or replacement.

Just out of curiosity, how is this rule enforced? Most scorekeepers, based on my experience, do not track each and every substitution. The officials certainly have other things to worry about. What if UNI's coach would have pointed out the situation to the R, but then KU's staff says "no that wasn't him that just came off the floor"? If the scorekeeper can't help, how would the situation be resolved?

[jdmara]

Originally Posted by KCRC

Just out of curiosity, how is this rule enforced? Most scorekeepers, based on my experience, do not track each and every substitution. The officials certainly have other things to worry about. What if UNI's coach would have pointed out the situation to the R, but then KU's staff says "no that wasn't him that just came off the floor"? If the scorekeeper can't help, how would the situation be resolved?

At the DI college level, every substitute is tracked when they leave and enter the game.

-Josh

[KCRC]

Originally Posted by jdmara

At the DI college level, every substitute is tracked when they leave and enter the game.

-Josh

Thank you. So, is it then the responsibility of the scorekeeper to bring any illegal substitions to the attention of the R?

[jdmara]

Originally Posted by KCRC

Thank you. So, is it then the responsibility of the scorekeeper to bring any illegal substitions to the attention of the R?

I previously have done stats for a DI program in both football and basketball. It would be difficult to figure out, honestly. The officials/coaches/scorer would have to recognize it first, then they could check with the stat keepers to see the substitution list. From the two programs that I've worked with, the stat keepers are different entities than the scorebook. They do collaborate after the game however (and sometimes at halftime) and then submit the stats to the NCAA.

-Josh

[jdmara]

Originally Posted by jdmara

I previously have done stats for a DI program in both football and basketball. It would be difficult to figure out, honestly. The officials/coaches/scorer would have to recognize it first, then they could check with the stat keepers to see the substitution list. From the two programs that I've worked with, the stat keepers are different entities than the scorebook. They do collaborate after the game however (and sometimes at halftime) and then submit the stats to the NCAA.

-Josh

I inquired and the "scorebook assistant" (next to the scorebook) does keep a running list of subs as well as the stat keepers.

-Josh

[Adam]

I've caught it once. B1 commits a foul and coach pulls him out after the first free throw. Second free throw is made and the horn buzzes. I turn as I beckon the subs in and notice B1 coming back in. I sent him back.
Coach: "I was just testing you."

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by KCRC

Thank you. So, is it then the responsibility of the scorekeeper to bring any illegal substitions to the attention of the R?

KCRC, something to add to your officiating repertoire--when bringing in subs mentally note the number(s) of the player(s) leaving the game.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

KCRC, something to add to your officiating repertoire--when bringing in subs mentally note the number(s) of the player(s) leaving the game.

Yep. Especially late in the game when this type of substitution is common. I've caught it a couple of times.

[eyezen]

Originally Posted by jdmara

At the DI college level, every substitute is tracked when they leave and enter the game.

-Josh

Correct - And sometimes below as well, typically they have the computerized play by play to reference if the issue comes up.

It is my understanding this is one of the jobs of the alternate during the conf tourney's and beyond to oversee.

[BillyMac]

Too bad chseagle is out counting people, otherwise this thread would be right up his alley.