The Official Forum

The Official Forum (https://forum.officiating.com/)
-   Basketball (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/)
-   -   block/charge by rule (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/57078-block-charge-rule.html)

Raymond Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:23am

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 661166)
I agree with Bob: the specification of how to obtain LGP does not require that the opponent be in contact with the court.

We're discussing a specific play here. In this specific play it doesn't matter where the defender is when A1 is airborne...it matters where the defender is when A1 lands. B1 can dance an Irish jig while A1 is airborne.

Adam Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:32am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 661185)
We're discussing a specific play here. In this specific play it doesn't matter where the defender is when A1 is airborne...it matters where the defender is when A1 lands. B1 can dance an Irish jig while A1 is airborne.

While he can't gain LGP within the flight path of A1, he can certainly gain LGP one inch beyond that path.

The OP still hasn't cleared up whether B1 established LGP prior to A2 leaving the floor, or after.

Raymond Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:39am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 661187)
While he can't gain LGP within the flight path of A1, he can certainly gain LGP one inch beyond that path.

The OP still hasn't cleared up whether B1 established LGP prior to A2 leaving the floor, or after.

Which is why I'm drawing out this conversation:

Quote:

Originally Posted by splitveer
... while in the air A2 caught the ball with B1 gaining legal guarding position and before A2 landed he crashed into B1...

How did B1 gain LGP while A2 was airborne if A2 crashed into B1 before landing?

Rich Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:41am

Last night we had a play where the home coach wasn't pleased with the call, but I know it was the right one.

B22 goes up for a rebound. He skies, get the ball, and A4 slides just enough under him so when B22 lands he hits A4's leg (which is outside his torso) and stumbles to the floor. I immediately call a foul on A4. Coach asked how it was a foul after I reported and went tableside. Simple reply: "He's gotta let him land there."

Adam Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:48am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 661188)
How did B1 gain LGP while A2 was airborne if A2 crashed into B1 before landing?

I agree, which is why I asked the question initially. I'm basing the ambiguity on the fact that he was asking about time and distance.

Raymond Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:53am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 661192)
I agree, which is why I asked the question initially. I'm basing the ambiguity on the fact that he was asking about time and distance.

Agreed about "time and distance" not being a factor here.

But in this specific play we don't know for sure if defender has LGP until airborne player either crashes before landing or lands before crashing.

bob jenkins Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 661188)
Which is why I'm drawing out this conversation:



How did B1 gain LGP while A2 was airborne if A2 crashed into B1 before landing?

In that specific example, he didn't.

That wasn't what I was responding to.

The thread also included comments about landing and then crashing, and you said it was impossible to establish LGP until landing. My response is specifically to that statement.

Raymond Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 661198)
In that specific example, he didn't.

That wasn't what I was responding to.

The thread also included comments about landing and then crashing, and you said it was impossible to establish LGP until landing. My response is specifically to that statement.

What B1 was doing while A2 is airborne is irrelevent. It's the fact that B1 had LGP when A2 landed that is relevent. That's basically my point.

The OP stated that B1 established LGP while A2 was airborne but that A2 crashed into B1 before landing. With all the back-and-forth, that very important snippet of the post was not addressed.

Adam Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 661221)
What B1 was doing while A2 is airborne is irrelevent. It's the fact that B1 had LGP when A2 landed that is relevent. That's basically my point.

The OP stated that B1 established LGP while A2 was airborne but that A2 crashed into B1 before landing. With all the back-and-forth, that very important snippet of the post was not addressed.

Actually, the very first two responses in thread addressed it.

Raymond Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 661223)
Actually, the very first two responses in thread addressed it.

I'm more prone to read msg #7. :p

Adam Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 661225)
I'm more prone to read msg #7. :p

LMAO

I still haven't found out whether I was wrong, though. :D

splitveer Fri Feb 12, 2010 01:55pm

Thanks for all the thoughts. My big concern was with time and distance. I do know that if LGP was established before A2 left the floor then caught the ball it will be a charge. If A2 lands then crashes into B1 who has established LGP then it is also a charge. The key here is gaining LGP to enforce the block charge call. I didn't know if because A2 was in the air without the ball he had the same stipulations as in a time and distance situation with someone moving without the ball. My interpretation through this process and the rule book has led me to when A2 catches the ball he is now under the same rules as a player in control of the ball and time and distance are not required.

Adam Fri Feb 12, 2010 02:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by splitveer (Post 661240)
Thanks for all the thoughts. My big concern was with time and distance. I do know that if LGP was established before A2 left the floor then caught the ball it will be a charge. If A2 lands then crashes into B1 who has established LGP then it is also a charge. The key here is gaining LGP to enforce the block charge call. I didn't know if because A2 was in the air without the ball he had the same stipulations as in a time and distance situation with someone moving without the ball. My interpretation through this process and the rule book has led me to when A2 catches the ball he is now under the same rules as a player in control of the ball and time and distance are not required.

So was I right in assuming, with your play, that B1 had established LGP prior to A2 becoming airborne?

You're right, Time and Distance aren't relevant, even if he leaves the floor without the ball, once A2 makes the catch.

Raymond Fri Feb 12, 2010 02:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 661243)
So was I right in assuming, with your play, that B1 had established LGP prior to A2 becoming airborne?

You're right, Time and Distance aren't relevant, even if he leaves the floor without the ball, once A2 makes the catch.

Not clear until he clarifies this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by splitveer
...and while in the air A2 caught the ball with B1 gaining legal guarding position...

Reads like B1 was still moving to get LGP when A2 was airborne. Now, if he were to amend to read: ...and while in the air A2 caught the ball with B1 having gained legal guarding position prior to A2 leaving his feet...

splitveer Fri Feb 12, 2010 02:34pm

You are correct.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:32am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1