Officials Uniform Problems

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I was not asking because I care, I am asking because I was curious as to why it was so important to have a shirt with a flag and not with one. Honestly what you do is up to you, but I am not bringing a shirt with a flag anyway nor care if my partner wears one. Matching shirts is the least of my concern.

Peace

I quit bothering with the flagless shirt once I realized that everyone here has one. The benefit of living in a military town.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I quit bothering with the flagless shirt once I realized that everyone here has one. The benefit of living in a military town.

I do not think it always has to deal with military towns or even focus. For example no one even wore a flag on the shirt in my state (and it was not policy to do so) until the 9-11 events. That happened during football season and everyone ran out and got a flag on their shirt as we were given the option to wear one. By the time basketball season came around nearly over 2 months later it was a hit and miss kind of thing. Actually I rarely see officials to this day wear flags for basketball officiating. It is still very common in football, where as if an official did not wear a flag it would be noticed. And there was a period of time where officials tried to match, but I never put a flag on my shirts because I did not want to mess up a shirt by putting on another patch and hardly use the shirt. Then I soon got over matching as it is often a silly exercise when no one but us cares either way. So I stopped caring and just use plain shirts other than the state patch we must wear. Even in college games I have no patch on any of my shirts.

Peace

[CDurham]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I do not think it always has to deal with military towns or even focus. For example no one even wore a flag on the shirt in my state (and it was not policy to do so) until the 9-11 events. That happened during football season and everyone ran out and got a flag on their shirt as we were given the option to wear one. By the time basketball season came around nearly over 2 months later it was a hit and miss kind of thing. Actually I rarely see officials to this day wear flags for basketball officiating. It is still very common in football, where as if an official did not wear a flag it would be noticed. And there was a period of time where officials tried to match, but I never put a flag on my shirts because I did not want to mess up a shirt by putting on another patch and hardly use the shirt. Then I soon got over matching as it is often a silly exercise when no one but us cares either way. So I stopped caring and just use plain shirts other than the state patch we must wear. Even in college games I have no patch on any of my shirts.

Peace

I don't see the point other than patriotism. I mean if your in NC obviously you are in the United States officiating. If your calling in France I could see where the flag could come in handy

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I do not think it always has to deal with military towns or even focus. For example no one even wore a flag on the shirt in my state (and it was not policy to do so) until the 9-11 events. That happened during football season and everyone ran out and got a flag on their shirt as we were given the option to wear one. By the time basketball season came around nearly over 2 months later it was a hit and miss kind of thing. Actually I rarely see officials to this day wear flags for basketball officiating. It is still very common in football, where as if an official did not wear a flag it would be noticed. And there was a period of time where officials tried to match, but I never put a flag on my shirts because I did not want to mess up a shirt by putting on another patch and hardly use the shirt. Then I soon got over matching as it is often a silly exercise when no one but us cares either way. So I stopped caring and just use plain shirts other than the state patch we must wear. Even in college games I have no patch on any of my shirts.

Peace

When I was in Iowa (post 9-11), it wasn't overwhelmingly common from my experience. Here, it is. I can't say for sure if the difference is the fact that it's a military town, as my previous area wasn't a mil town and it was just as ubiquitous. That was as much of a "God and Country" area, though, for folks on both sides of the aisle (I mention that only to note patriotism isn't considered a political issue here so much as I noticed it as such in Des Moines outside of the officiating community).

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I do not think it always has to deal with military towns or even focus. For example no one even wore a flag on the shirt in my state (and it was not policy to do so) until the 9-11 events. That happened during football season and everyone ran out and got a flag on their shirt as we were given the option to wear one. By the time basketball season came around nearly over 2 months later it was a hit and miss kind of thing. Actually I rarely see officials to this day wear flags for basketball officiating. It is still very common in football, where as if an official did not wear a flag it would be noticed. And there was a period of time where officials tried to match, but I never put a flag on my shirts because I did not want to mess up a shirt by putting on another patch and hardly use the shirt. Then I soon got over matching as it is often a silly exercise when no one but us cares either way. So I stopped caring and just use plain shirts other than the state patch we must wear. Even in college games I have no patch on any of my shirts.

Peace

The state patch is just as idiotic, far as I'm concerned. We don't have one here. I like having no patch on a shirt at all.

I agree with you, BTW, but we always have tried to match flag or no flag. Maybe I'll give that up at some point.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

The state patch is just as idiotic, far as I'm concerned. We don't have one here. I like having no patch on a shirt at all.

I agree with you, BTW, but we always have tried to match flag or no flag. Maybe I'll give that up at some point.

I'm going to disagree with you Rich, as it shows you're properly licensed, otherwise any chooch can go to Dick's, buy a shirt and start 'reffing' which some do on maverick park district stuff. It's very noticable here if you don't have a patch. Another patch of pride is a state final patch which the lucky ones wear and it's also worn with pride. The IHSA in Illinois is a very large and strong association which requires a few things to become licensed. It may sound corny, but I'm proud to wear that patch.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by fullor30

I'm going to disagree with you Rich, as it shows you're properly licensed, otherwise any chooch can go to Dick's, buy a shirt and start 'reffing' which some do on maverick park district stuff. It's very noticable here if you don't have a patch. Another patch of pride is a state final patch which the lucky ones wear and it's also worn with pride. The IHSA in Illinois is a very large and strong association which requires a few things to become licensed. It may sound corny, but I'm proud to wear that patch.

If you've got chucklheads buying shirts and reffing, there's nothing to stop them from getting an IL state patch on their shirt.

The last time I wore a shirt without the IAABO patch (I was matching my unpatched partner in a JV game), some stiff in the stands yelled out, "go back to school and get your patch!" It made me laugh.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

The state patch is just as idiotic, far as I'm concerned. We don't have one here. I like having no patch on a shirt at all.

I agree with you, BTW, but we always have tried to match flag or no flag. Maybe I'll give that up at some point.

Originally Posted by fullor30

I'm going to disagree with you Rich, as it shows you're properly licensed, otherwise any chooch can go to Dick's, buy a shirt and start 'reffing' which some do on maverick park district stuff. It's very noticable here if you don't have a patch. Another patch of pride is a state final patch which the lucky ones wear and it's also worn with pride. The IHSA in Illinois is a very large and strong association which requires a few things to become licensed. It may sound corny, but I'm proud to wear that patch.

I disagree with Rich and agree with full completely. And if we really want to be honest, wearing a flag on an official’s uniform is very inappropriate. We are not governmental employees and we are not in the military. And half the time we have a flag on the uniform you get into a debate as to which way the stars are going on the flag in relationship to the front of the jersey. At least the state patch represents something from the state and is appropriate for what we are doing. Let governmental people wear the flag. I am not representing the country by working a high school basketball game (or any other sport for that matter).

It is so noticed that when I have worked AAU games (which it is not required to wear any patch) in this state, I have been accused of not being a licensed official.

I also agree with the pride thing, because you often see IHSA officials in NF publications wearing their state patch. The current patch is not as big as it used to be and does not stand out that much, but if you do not wear one everyone seems to notice.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I also agree with the pride thing, because you often see IHSA officials in NF publications wearing their state patch. The current patch is not as big as it used to be and does not stand out that much, but if you do not wear one everyone seems to notice.

Peace

Six years of being a reciprocal official and nobody ever asked about my lack of a patch. I sure wasn't putting one on for the 8-10 games a season I'd work, mostly around the holidays.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Wearing a flag on an official’s uniform is very inappropriate. We are not governmental employees and we are not in the military.

Rutledge: Are you referring to The United States Code Title 36 Chapter 10 Article 176 J:

No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations.

I did not have the honor and privilege of serving my country, but my late father served in WWII, fought his way across Africa and Italy, and received a medal for his participation in the Battle of Rome Arno. In his honor, and in his memory, I proudly wear a flag patch on my laboratory coat at work. If I'm doing something wrong, then they can come and arrest me.

Our local board started wearing flag patches during the first Persian Gulf War. Recently there has been some discussion regarding all our members wearing a gold trimmed flag patch, often described as being a, "military flag", that should only be worn by military personnel.

Discussions like this regarding the appropriateness of wearing, or not wearing, a flag patch are not just petty "code" debates, but, rather, are reminders to all of us about the importance of a symbol of our freedom, that some take for granted as they move through our everyday lives. Citizens of North Korea, Iran, and other oppressive countries, could be arrested for just discussing the appropriateness of wearing, or not wearing, a flag patch.

[tomegun]

I don't necessarily like wearing a flag and I would think I have earned the right to wear one or not. Trust me when I tell you, what someone wears does not mean they are willing to support that symbol until the end. I came across countless people in the military that have more business being in jail than serving the country. And some of the people I talk about are high-ranking officials.

If someone doesn't want to wear the flag, they shouldn't wear it.

I will need those retirement checks to keep coming though.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Recently there has been some discussion regarding all our members wearing a gold trimmed flag patch, often described as being a, "War flag", that should only be worn by military personnel.

I've heard this claim made several times but have never see any actual documentation to back it up.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Rutledge: Are you referring to The United States Code Title 36 Chapter 10 Article 176 J:

No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations.

I did not have the honor and privilege of serving my country, but my late father served in WWII, fought his way across Africa and Italy, and received a medal for his participation in the Battle of Rome Arno. In his honor, and in his memory, I proudly wear a flag patch on my laboratory coat at work. If I'm doing something wrong, then they can come and arrest me.

Our local board started wearing flag patches during the first Persian Gulf War. Recently there has been some discussion regarding all our members wearing a gold trimmed flag patch, often described as being a, "military flag", that should only be worn by military personnel.

Discussions like this regarding the appropriateness of wearing, or not wearing, a flag patch are not just petty "code" debates, but, rather, are reminders to all of us about the importance of a symbol of our freedom, that some take for granted as they move through our everyday lives. Citizens of North Korea, Iran, and other oppressive countries, could be arrested for just discussing the appropriateness of wearing, or not wearing, a flag patch.

Billy,

My father is currently buried in a military cemetery in Memphis, Tennessee. So I do take this rather seriously. And my father served in Korea and his tombstone reflects his service. I do not fell in principle that we should be wearing them on officiating uniforms. Now what others do is their right to do. I am not going to be critical or judge those that do not agree with my position that is the beauty of the country. I just feel patriotism is more than wearing a flag on your shoulder or uniform.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by fullor30

I'm going to disagree with you Rich, as it shows you're properly licensed, otherwise any chooch can go to Dick's, buy a shirt and start 'reffing' which some do on maverick park district stuff. It's very noticable here if you don't have a patch. Another patch of pride is a state final patch which the lucky ones wear and it's also worn with pride. The IHSA in Illinois is a very large and strong association which requires a few things to become licensed. It may sound corny, but I'm proud to wear that patch.

It sounds corny. Sorry. The barrier to entry just isn't that great to warrant a patch. I had a drawer full of them (the IHSA kept sending them when I was a reciprocal official and I kept throwing them in a drawer, but I gave them to someone).

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

It sounds corny. Sorry. The barrier to entry just isn't that great to warrant a patch. I had a drawer full of them (the IHSA kept sending them when I was a reciprocal official and I kept throwing them in a drawer, but I gave them to someone).

So it trying to wear the exact same shirt because one person does not have a flag or not. Just saying.

Peace