Your Signal Peeves?
 

What are your non-Fed signal pet peeves?
I wonder where the "upward circling finger" when a free throw fails to hit the rim came from? :confused:
I scratch my already bald head when one's signal for a block looks more like a chicken dance than that faceless guy at the back of the book. :eek:
I grimace when, while reporting a "push" during rebounding action, a person does some kinda imitation of an old George Reeves superman. :eek:
I, as one observing a game, always note the confusion that sometimes occurs when an offical signals a time-out to the table using a "T" motion. :eek:
Are there any that you find either annoyingly obnoxious or frustratingly frivilous?
(It's a slow day today :o)

The brushing of the palms together to indicate that it was a clean blocked shot. Grrrr.

I hate the guy that won't turn off his darn directional signal on the way to the game!!!!:eek: Drives me absolutely CRAZY!! :D

Agree. Nothing says, "I know a lot is going on down here. But I don't know what to call." like making this signal does.

I hate when HS refs use the NBA mechanic for reporting numbers.

Hate it.

I use this to communicate with coaches when they ask things like "What about the contact" and I don't have time to stop and talk. Or to indicate that a defensive player touched the ball in a backcourt situation.

But I agree that it's annoying when it is done for no apparent reason.

The stop sign - it more of a chance to make a situation worse than anything else.

I also like when the Big Dogs who preach to the up-and-comers to use proper mechanics and you go watch one of their Big Dog games and they are using college mechanics (no stop/start clock for example).

Is that what they call refs from Boston or something? :D

Do you mean two hands? Our instructional chair announced that he has not problem with using two hands to report. This was this past Sunday. After the meeting, I was talking to another official who had a problem with this. My viewpoint is this: we have a lot more things to worry about besides one or two hands reporting to the table. What about getting plays right?

For those who also don't like this, is it a problem with the mechanic itself or the attitude that seems to always go along with the official doing it? I totally understand how some officials want to big time their partners so much, but if that wasn't the case would you still have a problem?

Fixed it. :o

Easy, Tom. The thread is about non-fed mechanics we don't like. Has nothing to do with anything else.

I think you're missing the point of the thread.

OK gentlemen. I will back away slowly...and I'm back!

I think I get the point of the thread. Is the stop sign a federation mechanic? I ask that question seriously 1) I don't have a book with me now and 2) I don't use it anyway...ever.

The two fingered directional point.
The directional point that is angled toward the sky. Parallel to the ground looks SO much better.
Choppy, short visible counts.
Waving hands at the buzzer to end a period (think canceling a basket) when there was no shot attempted or the shot was in time but no good. Hand straight up in the air people.
I don't work college, but I think the NCAA women's visible count mechanic (up at the head, 45 degree angle) is simply ridiculous.

It's not, but I believe the officials manual also instructs to report fouls with one hand.

Also, blowing your whistle in this situation. What's wrong with just letting the buzzer do its job?

Rookie reviewing his signals
1. OK
2. OK
3. OK
4. Oooppps - Have to work on that. :o It was how I was taught long ago (I think it was in July.)

How about using the double personal foul signal to report a full timeout.

Yes, and for a 30 sec TO when people point their thumbs to their shoulders and, worse yet, point their pinkies out! Grrrr

I get annoyed when, to indicate a player traveled while rolling on the floor, my partner gets down on the floor and rolls.

I'm also not sure the signal indicating there's a really well built busty mom in the stands is in the NF manual, but I appreciate it when my partner uses it.

Uh, they're not the same...60 sec time signal hands are open with palms facing forward....double foul signal hands are closed fists with palm side down.....

As for non standard signals, how about hammering the fists on the hips for a blocking foul? I've seen some officials do this so enthusiastically they must have bruises on their hips.....

Tim - I think that was his point - that some guys use the foul signal to signal the timeout.

Because the official, not the horn, declares the quarter over.

What's a double foul? Oh, that's another thread. I suppose I use fists here. Don't really see it as a big deal, although I do hate the thumbs on the shoulder -- and one of my partners does it on purpose cause I hate it. :D

Miss-read it Mark.....my bad.........

You seriously had a partner roll on the floor......how did you keep a straight face?

5-6-2

"Each quarter or extra period ends when the signal illuminates or sounds indicating time has expired, as in 1-14"

(obvious exceptions not included)

Rule #1. Never, ever take Padgett seriously.

5-6-2

Don't Ask
 

Actually, that's not Rule #1. There are, however, other posts which identify what is. I don't want to say.

What does this look like? I mean the signal not the Mom, but I am imagining....

Sometimes the NCAA has it right.

NCAA-W has a signal for hit to the head. It's a useful signal and everyone knows exactly what you're reporting.

I called a foul last night I normally would've passed on only because the defender swung and hit the ball handler in the head after she received a pass at the elbow. She then put up a jump shot, but I had already blown it down (it was a fairly significant hit to the head although she played through it nicely). She missed the shot. It was clearly a foul before the shot.

Now, which communicates the foul best to the players/coaches/table/spectators? The NCAA-W hit to the head or the NFHS hack?

Obvious exceptions are important since those are what usually actually end a quarter.

So if ball is inbounded and suddenly horn goes off for a late player entry, you stop game because it went off?

I was always taught, yes, horn goes off but we need a stop clock signal and a short toot at end of period

Every clinic I've ever been to in Chicago area stresses this.

"Travel" signal for throw-in violation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Usually a double whammy by employing wrong mechanic when no rules have been violated.

Yes, they are important.

But they're still exceptions. Your statement:
Is only true in regards to a few (4) exceptions.

The 'old pro' who gives the lazy little fist pump to start the clock.

You may have been taught this, but the fact is that it's not in the rule book. The horn ends the period, with the exception of 4 scenarios. Using a whistle outside of those 4 scenarios is redundant.

Maybe, but most quarters end with an attempted shot, at least around here. Do you let the ball simply fall and hit the ground and not acknowledge the shot attempt has ended with a whistle?

Around here, all quarters end with a whistle, regardless of the circumstances (except a made basket for most officials). It's expected. It's taught at clinics and camps.

Do you whistle in subs?

Did you not read where I just said that this is an exception to the rule, not the rule itself?

Like I said, that may be what you are taught, but your statement that the whistle ends the quarter at all times and not the buzzer is inaccurate according to the rule book.

If I need to get their attention because the clock operator didn't buzz them in I might. But as a general rule, no. Why? Is that a mechanic I'm not aware of?

Redundant is good thing when officiating.

Really, why is this important? So important that you took the time to quote chapter and verse on something so trivial?

Well, it would seem that the rules committee sees this as a situation where redundancy isn't necessary, otherwise, I'm sure they would have put in the rule book that an official's whistle, not the buzzer, ends a quarter in ALL cases, not just in the four exceptions.

Check the NFHS Mechanics Manual. Something they slipped in recently.

I was thinking about looking to see if there's guidance on an end-of-quarter whistle, but I've already packed my bag for tonight and it's in the trunk of my car in the garage. Garage unheated, I'm still in my workout clothes, so I'll look later.

Because you made a statement unsupported by rule, and I was attempting to clarify for officials out there who might take you at your word.

It's common practice around here, if you haven't noticed.

All you had to say is "my bad, you're right" and it would have been over. But you and fullor30 are trying to justify why the practice is necessary based on everything but the rule book.

ETA: And you, if you forgot, were the one who questioned my pet peeve. So, why was that so important that you took the time to question something that is fully supported by the rule book?

You know, I've been here a while. You'll never see me getting down and dirty with such minutiae, though. It bores me.

I would rather emphasize to others here that we (1) officiate with the rulebook, not using the rulebook as a script and (2) what is common practice locally is always more important to your advancement and success than what is explicitly written in those books.

Cause in many areas of the country, you'd be the only one not blowing his whistle. In that case, it's not a pet peeve, it's a failure to understand what's expected of you.

Fine, I'll go get the manual. Not that I treat it like a bible, but a rulebook is certainly not going to tell officials when to sound whistles and when not to sound whistles.

Interesting, then, why you started the minutiae to begin with.

Actually, it started with your pet peeve, which I found silly -- if you're keeping score.

That's all well and good, but maybe next time you shouldn't say

because to me, that reads like an official declaration of the way things are, not the way you're told to do things in your area.

If you think doing things according to what the rules say, rather than the way things are done in your particular area is silly, well, then bully for you.

This is entertaining and all....but I'll add my own.

Running the hand up and down the sideline or endline when calling an out of bounds violation. I understand why some do it I just don't care for it.

fiba signals
 

from the FIBA point of view, the Technical foul signal and time out signal are almost identical, many think I have called a T on the coach (at first) when I show the signal and point to his bench.
for those interested, below is a pic location of a time out, a t foul is open palm out instead of one finger but same setup

http://www.fiba.com/images/web/V3_Bb...strative_2.gif

a lot of high school referees, as I have seen, will tap the top of their head to say "under a minute left". That's not in NFHS at all. I did it in a game once, while I knew it wasn't an actual signal, and my partner jokingly asked "were you telling me your head was flat"? That was the last time I used that signal and I tell others not to do that. I'm usually taking a second to look at the clock when the ball is dead.

Because the official, not the clock, indicates there is under a minute left.

:D

I'm sure you will whistle every sub in from now on, too. See page 78 of the mechanics manual.

My point isn't that we shouldn't strive to do things right -- it's just that sometimes certain regions dictate their own mechanics. We aren't changing the rules of the game. Whether regions require officials to give certain signals or not isn't important as long as people are consistent on communicating.

The whistle at the end of the period is not specifically covered. I'll acknowledge that my wording was sloppy -- the period ends on the horn, not the whistle. Adding a toot doesn't change that nor does it make the toot wrong (unless you're in an area where it *is* considered wrong).

We point a finger in the air to alert our partners we're under a minute.

We also give the horns to each other on the 6th team foul and a little sideways two-finger signal on the 9th team foul.

Awareness isn't a bad thing.

Hey, don't drag me into your mud puddle with rich. You brought it up as a pet peeve and I'm telling you what every clinic does around here. I never blew it until I was chastised by a few guys. To me it dots the i's crosses the T's.

We start the game with a whistle, we end it that way. You do whatever you feel comfy with.

Now you've done it. I'm sure someone will say the game starts with the opening tip. :D

OFFICIALS MANUAL

2.3.6 Last-Second Shot:

C. Preparation: Use time-outs near the end of any period to communicate the
coverage for any last second shot. Each official should be aware of the
remaining time in a period and be alert for the timer’s signal.

D. Making the Call:
1. The Trail official is responsible for making the call on any last-second
shot and should communicate this to his/her partner. Such communication
should be repeated on any change of possession.

So how do you communicate this during play if there is no mechcanic. I am not advocating beating yourself in the head. But as long as both guys are on the same page does it really matter?

t foul
 

whew, over, I was just about to call a technical foul on you two

A Distinction with a Difference
 

Yes, you're apparently referring to the handy, somewhat subtle signals officials give to each other for the sake of good communication and keeping everybody on the crew on the same page. Those kinds of signals, while not prescribed by the Fed, I don't think should be discouraged. And those are the kinds of signals that differ the most, depending on what region of the country you're in. I've learned and now use some of those inter- (intra-?) crew gestures as I've learned them via various partners and instructors at camps. Very helpful. And I'm open to learning more.
Regarding the topic of the thread, I appreciate the uniformity when it comes to the mechanics of the signals as prescribed by the Fed. And I'm wondering whether it has a subtle impact upon the coaches we work with, too. When I was on the dark side (coaching), I always considered the uniformity of the crew to be an indication of their credibility. Like it or not, when the crew was uniform and clear in its mechanics, I'd be hesitant to challenge their judgment calls. Perhaps it was the appearance of professionalism that prompted me not to question their judgments as often.
I'm enjoying the responses to this thread, and have logged them on the pregame list I use when working with newbies. I thank you for the responses thusfar!

The old double-fist hip-banging block has to be at the top. In one clinic I attended they told us not to do that. An official was sued by a middle school girls' parents for making an obscene gesture at their daughter - and won.

Oh, you know what I mean.;)

I know I take that rule very seriously.

Agreed, these are good crew communication techniques. Just a little help to make sure we're all on the same page. I don't think anyone can argue with these (how soon will I eat my words on that one?).

I do not believe this. Post a link or something.

You don't have to if you pre-gamed it.

Every single one of my pre-games involves me saying "And let's remember that the trail always has the last shot."

Once you've communicated that, not patting on the head is really necessary. That's just my preference, though.

I think you meant to say, "I've got last shot."

How about C opposite table? Or do you only do two man games?

I only do 2-man games, unfortunately.

That's the other problem I have with this mechanic. It means different things to different people. I've had partners who think the "mechanic" means "I've got the last shot" and some who think it means "clock is under one minute."

I've been in games before where the lead is patting his head and I'm shaking my head "no" at him and he's looking at me like I'm crazy.

I think of Curly when I see the head pat. I will point to my wrist to advise my partner of under a minute left and pat my chest if I have last shot.

I think they were misinformed, patting head or chest means 'mine' that's just common sense. One finger up has always been clock reminder in my world.

Your world ain't the only world. The few people I've worked with that pat the head always mean to communicate that the clock is under a minute. Who actually has the last shot is discussed in pregame.

That's rule #3. We all know what #s 1 and 2 are.

That's why I said my. How do you signal who has last shot on your planet?

huh?
 

the trail or the C if he/she is across from the table. This is, as was said earlier, discussed in the pregame, not with 1:01 to go

Seriously? I've officiated in three different metro areas in two states. Some have used the head pat, others the wrist tap, and in my current association we point to the sky. I tend to chest pat if it's mine, but we always pregame the last shot as well. The reminder is good, though.

We also use the horns at 6 fouls pull the trigger finger when we have a sub for a FT shooter.

My peeve is the foul tip signal, especially when the trail does it on a play in front of me as lead.

I've never seen the pat on the head either... well I have, but not on a basketball court.

I point to the sky for under a minute which reminds us and whoever is opposite table knows it's their call.

Some around here will point to the sky for under and minute and chest pat for under 30 seconds.

Actually, I thought maybe Juulie had hurt herself. :rolleyes:

Actually, the clock DOES tell us, in this circumstance, that there is under a minute left.....:D

She's gonna get you for that one!:D

Dang it Mark!!
 

My wife was telling a story and I was supposed to be listening, but my unexpected laugh gave away that I was actually reading the forum off my laptop.

just the messenger
 

Unfortunately, I don't have a link or other reference. I may be able to get one but it will take awhile. As I said, this was something that was momentarily brought up in a clinic.

I'm with Rich on this; highly skeptical.

For 2-man mechanics, it is usually discussed in pregame who will take the last shot. A lot depends on clock locations, if there aren't 2 clocks. If there are 2 clocks the trail has it always. We signal pointing a finger in the air to indicate we're under 1 minute in both 2-man and 3-man. In 3-man we'll generally all communicate who has the last shot (C or T opposite table) when the clock is under a minute and make sure we all know who has it by pointing to the one who has it and the one who has it will pat their chest. Usually.

1) you've gotta pre-game last shot, because if you just rely on the chest or head pat signal, then there's gonna be a quick steal and fast break just after said pat, and neither of you is gonna know who's supposed to watch off ball. (This really happened to me just this evening! Fortunately, the fast break was late enough that the ball never got up on a shot, but still...)

2) Mark, I WAS hurt, you dork!

3) My pet peeve signal?? It was new to me this year, it's the "safe" signal, from baseball, but partner used it to mean "no foul". After the second safe signal that she gave while I was actually blowing the whistle for a foul, I went to her and said, "Please don't do that again!!" She said, "Oh, everyone around here uses the safe signal". Which was news to me, since I've been working "around here" for 11 years, and I've never seen it before, and can't imagine anyone thinking it's a good idea. And she was clueless why it bothered me! Oh, well.

The Worst Signal Yet ! ! !
 

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Was that during a play along the "baseline" :D

I'll go with Snaq with the tip signal on a block shot. But other times I think it's good to communicate the tip signal (a ball slightly deflected by the defense that goes into the backcourt).

I used to get worked up about signals that weren't 'by the book' but after awhile I realize we're just communicating. If a coach is yelling for a travel when there is no control I might use a small 'bobble' signal. That said, do I look like a Solid Gold dancer out there, heck no. I would say 95% of my signals are by the book.

Pet peeve:
Indicating with two fingers that the goal is for 2 points (not for 3). If the official does not go up with two arms for a 3 point signal, then it is a 2 (generally speaking). I can see why this may be used for emphasis occasionally, but it is becoming common place on every outside shot with many partners I work with.

Barbra Is Starting To Sing Again ...
 

That's the only time I use it, usually when the shooter has a foot touching the three point line.

We have a Connecticut only mechanic to point to floor for two-point field goal try when shooter has foot touching three point line. As the trail, when this occurs in my area, if the ball goes in, I follow up with the two fingers and also state, "Two".

Of course, I'm experienced enough to remember when the trail had to indicate one, or two (no three back then) for every point. It was a hard habit to break when we switched to no point signals, except for a made three. Note that I said experienced, not old. I started officiating when I was three years old. Really.

Why? You should be listening for the horn, not watching the clock. It shouldn't matter where the clocks are located (or even if there is no clock at all).

Because the person who is facing the clock is able to see when the clock is getting close to zero. Think about it. If you have a clock only on one end of the gym and you haven't switched in a couple minutes, you may only be getting very quick looks occasionally during transition. Of course we listen for the horn, but if you aren't aware of the time left, you can be surprised by the horn, and that's never good.

Once the driver turns 70 yrs old, the signal never goes off.

Is there a signal for that?

he he :) he he ha ha :D giggle ha ha haw haw . . . lmao :D :D

Juulie called Mark a dork.

Wait a sec. I don't think that is the first time she has done that! :p