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-   -   Your Signal Peeves? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/55995-your-signal-peeves.html)

Raymond Sat Dec 19, 2009 09:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbcof83 (Post 643885)
Yes, and for a 30 sec TO when people point their thumbs to their shoulders and, worse yet, point their pinkies out! Grrrr
I use my thumbs to the shoulders. The authorized mechanic is gay (not that's there anything wrong with that :D). Think, "I'm a little teapot, short and stout."


Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 643999)
Seriously? I've officiated in three different metro areas in two states. ... but we always pregame the last shot as well. The reminder is good, though.

...
What novel concepts, pregame discussion and harmless in-game reminders. Obviously a regional thing Snaqs. :D

BillyMac Sun Dec 20, 2009 08:05am
The I'm A Little Teapot, Short And Stout Signal © 2009 BadNewsRef ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 644254)
The authorized mechanic is gay (not that's there anything wrong with that).
Haven't you seen the public service announcements with Wanda Sykes and Hilary Duff? I changed professions a few years ago, and now work with several much younger colleagues. That phrase was never a part of my vocabulary until I started hearing my colleagues, in their mid 20's, using it to mean stupid. It almost became a part of my vocabulary until I saw these PSA's.

http://i4.ytimg.com/vi/sWS0GVOQPs0/default.jpg

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/TVicCD8FmMs/default.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 644254)
Think, "I'm a little teapot, short and stout."
I always knew that this signal reminded me of something, but I could never quite put my finger on it. I think I learned this song in kindergarten, and now it's all coming back to me from the deep, dark, recesses, of my brain.

bob jenkins Sun Dec 20, 2009 09:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smitty (Post 644244)
Because the person who is facing the clock is able to see when the clock is getting close to zero. Think about it. If you have a clock only on one end of the gym and you haven't switched in a couple minutes, you may only be getting very quick looks occasionally during transition. Of course we listen for the horn, but if you aren't aware of the time left, you can be surprised by the horn, and that's never good.
The quick looks should be sufficient, expecially with good communication within the crew. Plus, one of the teams will have their backs to the clock for the entire period -- someone will be notifying them of the time remaining.

I agree that you shouldn't be surprised, but having your back to the clock doesn't (or shouldn't) lead to being surprised.

fullor30 Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 644254)
I use my thumbs to the shoulders. The authorized mechanic is gay (not that's there anything wrong with that :D). Think, "I'm a little teapot, short and stout."




What novel concepts, pregame discussion and harmless in-game reminders. Obviously a regional thing Snaqs. :D

To me, thumbs to shoulders is hot dog stuff, along with fists clenched for full TO, not to mention it's a double foul signal. Kind of I'm too cool for the room.

Just me.

Raymond Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 644296)
To me, thumbs to shoulders is hot dog stuff, along with fists clenched for full TO, not to mention it's a double foul signal. Kind of I'm too cool for the room.

Just me.
Well, that's ironic, since I've been told my officiating mechanics are too bland and I need some more flare. ;)

Welpe Tue Dec 22, 2009 05:46pm
The thumbs to the shoulders mechanic reminds me too much of the WWE. Now if a partner belts out with a Macho Man "30 seconds...oooooohhhh yeah!"...that is a different story entirely!

Mark Padgett Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scratch85 (Post 644253)
he he :) he he ha ha :D giggle ha ha haw haw . . . lmao :D :D

Juulie called Mark a dork.

Wait a sec. I don't think that is the first time she has done that! :p
In Oregon, "dork" is a compliment. :rolleyes:

26 Year Gap Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Padgett (Post 645005)
In Oregon, "dork" is a compliment. :rolleyes:
Coming from an area where pronouncing 'r's is optional, I suppose it is pretty close to 'duck'.

Zoochy Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:45pm
I have not read all 108 posts but, my pet peeve signal is when the official swings his/her arm and points to the floor to indicate 'foul on the floor'. It can appear to be that the official is counting a shot that goes through the basket. :eek:
Why not just use the 'No Shot' mechanic?
I also do not like the 'Aligator clap' to indicate blocked shot. Geez

Raymond Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoochy (Post 645021)
I have not read all 108 posts but, my pet peeve signal is when the official swings his/her arm and points to the floor to indicate 'foul on the floor'. It can appear to be that the official is counting a shot that goes through the basket. :eek:
Why not just use the 'No Shot' mechanic?
I also do not like the 'Aligator clap' to indicate blocked shot. Geez
My pet peeve is an official calling the foul "on the floor" in the first place since 90% of the time the player has started his shooting motion.

Scratch85 Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Padgett (Post 645005)
In Oregon, "dork" is a compliment. :rolleyes:

No . . . "Big Dork" is a compliment! :cool:

Freddy Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:58pm
Stamp Out "On the Floor"!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 645025)
My pet peeve is an official calling the foul "on the floor" in the first place since 90% of the time the player has started his shooting motion.
Last week I, from C, call a foul for a handcheck, well before the offensive player's shooting motion started. He continued his motion and the shot, which wouldn't count anyway, went in. I'm saying "no shot, no shot", giving the handcheck signal. My partner at L repeatedly gives what everybody in the gym interpreted as "the basket was good" signal :eek:. I go to confer with him. He said, "I was signalling that it was 'on the floor'" :mad:. The coach of the shooter asks, after I reported the foul to the table, "What did you guys have to do, flip a coin?"
Didn't look good. :o
Enough of this "on the floor" stuff!

Zoochy Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 645025)
My pet peeve is an official calling the foul "on the floor" in the first place since 90% of the time the player has started his shooting motion.
I am with you on that one. I saw that a few times tonight as I watched 3 Holiday tournament games. Everytime the player had habitually picked up the dribble and was trying to continue the attempt for a try. All were ruled foul "on the floor" Continuation rule 4-11 and fundamental 17.

constable Wed Dec 23, 2009 12:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbcof83 (Post 643853)
The two fingered directional point.
The directional point that is angled toward the sky. Parallel to the ground looks SO much better.
Choppy, short visible counts.
Waving hands at the buzzer to end a period (think canceling a basket) when there was no shot attempted or the shot was in time but no good. Hand straight up in the air people.
I don't work college, but I think the NCAA women's visible count mechanic (up at the head, 45 degree angle) is simply ridiculous.
I see nothing wrong with the directional point with 2 fingers. IMHO it looks much sharper than using the entire hand.

I also agree the FIBA signal for a timeout and technical are too close for comfort.

fullor30 Wed Dec 23, 2009 03:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by constable (Post 645042)
I see nothing wrong with the directional point with 2 fingers. IMHO it looks much sharper than using the entire hand.

I also agree the FIBA signal for a timeout and technical are too close for comfort.
Again, too cool for room. Do you want to look sharp or do the right mechanic?

Another pet peeve. Inbounding, and ref covers side of mouth, turns like he's sneezing or coughing and whistles.

bob jenkins Wed Dec 23, 2009 03:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 645300)
Another pet peeve. Inbounding, and ref covers side of mouth, turns like he's sneezing or coughing and whistles.
That's to avoid blowing the whistle right in the ear of the inbounder.

fullor30 Wed Dec 23, 2009 03:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 645302)
That's to avoid blowing the whistle right in the ear of the inbounder.
You have a flair for the obvious Robert.

Back In The Saddle Wed Dec 23, 2009 07:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 645300)
Do you want to look sharp or do the right mechanic?
My signal pet peeve is people who don't understand that all mechanics, including signals, exist to serve us. Not the other way round.

Signaling mechanics facilitate communication, on multiple levels. On the surface they communicate our decisions. How the signals are executed communicates deeper, more important information. A sharp looking signal communicates confidence, experience, control. A shabby looking one conveys the opposite.

With signals, the mechanic isn't "right" if it doesn't look sharp. And since we all differ a little physically, we don't all look the same way when executing the same signal. What looks sharp from you may look terrible from me. So a slight variation on any signal that still clearly conveys the surface information, but which an official can execute with much better presentation is better IMHO.

j51969 Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle (Post 645362)
My signal pet peeve is people who don't understand that all mechanics, including signals, exist to serve us. Not the other way round.

Signaling mechanics facilitate communication, on multiple levels. On the surface they communicate our decisions. How the signals are executed communicates deeper, more important information. A sharp looking signal communicates confidence, experience, control. A shabby looking one conveys the opposite.

With signals, the mechanic isn't "right" if it doesn't look sharp. And since we all differ a little physically, we don't all look the same way when executing the same signal. What looks sharp from you may look terrible from me. So a slight variation on any signal that still clearly conveys the surface information, but which an official can execute with much better presentation is better IMHO.
Well spoken, and very true.

fullor30 Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle (Post 645362)
My signal pet peeve is people who don't understand that all mechanics, including signals, exist to serve us. Not the other way round.

Signaling mechanics facilitate communication, on multiple levels. On the surface they communicate our decisions. How the signals are executed communicates deeper, more important information. A sharp looking signal communicates confidence, experience, control. A shabby looking one conveys the opposite.

With signals, the mechanic isn't "right" if it doesn't look sharp. And since we all differ a little physically, we don't all look the same way when executing the same signal. What looks sharp from you may look terrible from me. So a slight variation on any signal that still clearly conveys the surface information, but which an official can execute with much better presentation is better IMHO.
Everyone has their own 'game'. I agree with you 100% regarding differing physically and what may look sharp etc. That said, I don't care for the thumbs for a 30. Much ado about nothing really

Just me.

Back In The Saddle Thu Dec 24, 2009 03:00am
I find the objection to the thumbs on a 30 interesting. Around here everybody uses the thumbs. But in the past couple of weeks I have begun using the proper mechanic for this (ironically I'm making the change as part of conscious effort to stop mixing mechanics from different levels). I'll tell you what, it just doesn't feel right. I need to try this in the mirror and see if it looks as awkward as it feels. If I can't make it look good, I'm gonna have to go back to the thumbs. :D

Raymond Thu Dec 24, 2009 07:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle (Post 645481)
I find the objection to the thumbs on a 30 interesting. Around here everybody uses the thumbs. But in the past couple of weeks I have begun using the proper mechanic for this (ironically I'm making the change as part of conscious effort to stop mixing mechanics from different levels). I'll tell you what, it just doesn't feel right. I need to try this in the mirror and see if it looks as awkward as it feels. If I can't make it look good, I'm gonna have to go back to the thumbs. :D
That's funny, the other night I used the proper "teapot" mechanic for some subconscious reason.

I'm working some tournament games next week, I'm pay attention to see what other refs are doing.

BillyMac Thu Dec 24, 2009 07:57am
For Legal Purposes, Consider This A Written Warning ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 645508)
The other night I used the proper "teapot" mechanic for some subconscious reason.
Watch out. You're treading on thin copyright infringement ice.

The I'm A Little Teapot, Short And Stout Signal © 2009 BadNewsRef
The use of the phrase, "I'm A Little Teapot, Short And Stout Signal", without the express written consent of BadNewsRef is strictly prohibited.

tomegun Thu Dec 24, 2009 10:02am
Our instructional chair, new to the position this season, has college and pro basketball experience. He is also an associate of mine and we talk about things dealing with his position often. During our last meeting he told everyone that it is OK to report using two hands. As expected, some people were not happy and one official came to talk to me about it. I heard him out and offered him this compromise: once we start getting all of our plays right, we will worry about reporting with one hand or two. In the big scheme of things, it just doesn't matter. What matters more is introducing video clips to meetings, every meeting. What matters more is attempting to introduce absolutes into our game for consistency. What matters more is hustle and getting in the best position to see plays.

BNR has been around me enough to know I do like a friendly debate on mechanics though. :D

Raymond Thu Dec 24, 2009 01:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun (Post 645521)
...

BNR has been around me enough to know I do like a friendly debate on mechanics though. :D
Would that include the mechanic of the Lead official calling on the other side of the paint?

tomegun Thu Dec 24, 2009 01:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 645550)
Would that include the mechanic of the Lead official calling on the other side of the paint?
You said that just so I could grit my teeth huh? I was watching a game the other night. A player gets the ball near the post on the other side of the paint from the lead. The kid makes an up-and-under move - tweet, and one - from the lead. [Grrrrrr] It wasn't a play that the C couldn't clearly see. I ask him about it after the game and he says, "It was right in front of me." So, I ask how it could be in front of him when the moved started outside the paint on the other side of the lane. He still says it was right in front of him even though it wasn't. He walks away and his partner tells me, "He was doing that the whole game." I will be discussing this with his crew chiefs, who happen to be my friends.

tjones1 Thu Dec 24, 2009 01:59pm
Here are my signal peeves... he's got some good ones though. :D

YouTube - High-Stress REF

fullor30 Thu Dec 24, 2009 02:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun (Post 645558)
You said that just so I could grit my teeth huh? I was watching a game the other night. A player gets the ball near the post on the other side of the paint from the lead. The kid makes an up-and-under move - tweet, and one - from the lead. [Grrrrrr] It wasn't a play that the C couldn't clearly see. I ask him about it after the game and he says, "It was right in front of me." So, I ask how it could be in front of him when the moved started outside the paint on the other side of the lane. He still says it was right in front of him even though it wasn't. He walks away and his partner tells me, "He was doing that the whole game." I will be discussing this with his crew chiefs, who happen to be my friends.
Boy, he's in trouble now.........:rolleyes:

Adam Thu Dec 24, 2009 02:13pm
1. Frankenstein
2. Travel signal for a throwin violation.
3. "Let it hit the rim" on free throws.
4. Foul tip on blocked shots.

not necessarily in that order.

fullor30 Thu Dec 24, 2009 02:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 645568)
1. Frankenstein
2. Travel signal for a throwin violation.
3. "Let it hit the rim" on free throws.
4. Foul tip on blocked shots.

not necessarily in that order.
Had a two man tourney game yesterday and I'm trail as defender in my primary hacks shooter down low, I signal foul and partner does foul tip sign from other side of paint.:(

Rich Thu Dec 24, 2009 02:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 645568)
1. Frankenstein
2. Travel signal for a throwin violation.
3. "Let it hit the rim" on free throws.
4. Foul tip on blocked shots.

not necessarily in that order.
Is Frankenstein what I call the "creeping death foul?"

fullor30 Thu Dec 24, 2009 02:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichMSN (Post 645573)
Is Frankenstein what I call the "creeping death foul?"
I'm not sure either. I'm guessing the really stiff, quick herky jerky moves. Kind of like old white guys dancing :D

Adam Thu Dec 24, 2009 02:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichMSN (Post 645573)
Is Frankenstein what I call the "creeping death foul?"
Exactly. AKA "zombie." And the worst part is it's usually verbalized as "over the back."

fullor30 Thu Dec 24, 2009 03:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 645581)
Exactly. AKA "zombie." And the worst part is it's usually verbalized as "over the back."
Haha!! haven't seen that one in years!

26 Year Gap Thu Dec 24, 2009 04:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 645568)
1. Frankenstein
2. Travel signal for a throwin violation.
3. "Let it hit the rim" on free throws.
4. Foul tip on blocked shots.

not necessarily in that order.
I had a guy use the first signal AND say 'over the back' the other night.
But is was closer to THIS:
http://www.chicagostagereview.com/wp...cula-film1.jpg

26 Year Gap Thu Dec 24, 2009 04:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle (Post 645481)
I find the objection to the thumbs on a 30 interesting. Around here everybody uses the thumbs. But in the past couple of weeks I have begun using the proper mechanic for this (ironically I'm making the change as part of conscious effort to stop mixing mechanics from different levels). I'll tell you what, it just doesn't feel right. I need to try this in the mirror and see if it looks as awkward as it feels. If I can't make it look good, I'm gonna have to go back to the thumbs. :D
Basketball is a game of finesse....not for one who is all thumbs.

Back In The Saddle Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:52pm
That would be why I ref and no longer play. :p

Raymond Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun (Post 645558)
You said that just so I could grit my teeth huh? I was watching a game the other night. A player gets the ball near the post on the other side of the paint from the lead. The kid makes an up-and-under move - tweet, and one - from the lead. [Grrrrrr] It wasn't a play that the C couldn't clearly see. I ask him about it after the game and he says, "It was right in front of me." So, I ask how it could be in front of him when the moved started outside the paint on the other side of the lane. He still says it was right in front of him even though it wasn't. He walks away and his partner tells me, "He was doing that the whole game." I will be discussing this with his crew chiefs, who happen to be my friends.

I called a foul in my first game of the year as Lead on a play that was on the other side of the basket from me. I saw a DVD of the game and I absolutely got the call wrong. It was a clean block (which I couldn't see from my position) and with a little bit of incidental contact down low. I learned my lesson for the season. :)

ripcord51 Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:07am
I still work with a dude who after every "jump ball" still feels it necessary to point and declare the numbers of the two opposing players that will be "jumping it up" He has even asked me for clarification to make sure he gets the two players correct. Then after all that proceeds to go to the arrow. Drives me crazy.

BillyMac Fri Dec 25, 2009 03:07pm
Wayback Machine Set To 1983 ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ripcord51 (Post 645788)
I still work with a dude who after every "jump ball" still feels it necessary to point and declare the numbers of the two opposing players that will be "jumping it up".
That's because you want to be sure that the two players involved jump, rather than having a tall "ringer" switch with one of the "real" jumpers... Wait a minute... Never mind.

http://thm-a02.yimg.com/image/5c5d45d13a93e120

rwest Fri Dec 25, 2009 04:19pm
Couldn't agree more!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smitty (Post 643824)
The brushing of the palms together to indicate that it was a clean blocked shot. Grrrr.
I had this during a game. Lead made the "clean block shot" signal while the trail called a foul. I explained to the official why this is a bad mechanic. We now have two officials with two different calls. One has a foul, one has a blocked shot.

It's like two umpires in softball making a call at the same base, one safe and one out!

If you don't have a foul, then don't raise your fist! To me this is just an attempt to get everyone off your back for not making a call on a clean block.

Adam Fri Dec 25, 2009 04:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwest (Post 645841)
To me this is just an attempt to get everyone off your back for not making a call on a clean block.
That's exactly what it is.

Stat-Man Fri Dec 25, 2009 04:52pm
HS or lower officials using NBA signals.

A few years ago, I was at an 8th grade girls game where the official used the NBA "Loose Ball Foul" signal. I had to resist the urge to ask if that meant we also had defensive three seconds. :D

constable Fri Dec 25, 2009 06:27pm
I would like to see a signal for basket interference- the NBA has one.

Our association permits the 2 hand point. I don't have the IAABO book infront of me so I can't recall whether they do or not.

point with 2 fingers or a full hand, if that is the weakest part of an officials game I think they are doing just fine.

BillyMac Fri Dec 25, 2009 07:28pm
Oldie, But Goodie ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stat-Man (Post 645849)
The NBA "Loose Ball Foul" signal. I had to resist the urge to ask if that meant we also had defensive three seconds.
How about, "Three to make two."?

dsqrddgd909 Sat Dec 26, 2009 09:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 645867)
How about, "Three to make two."?
LOVED that rule. It didn't help Billy McGinnis though. Playoff game - missed all 3 and I think one was an air ball.

BillyMac Sat Dec 26, 2009 10:07am
These Are The Best ???
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsqrddgd909 (Post 645946)
Loved that rule.
College players only get two to make two. High school players only get two to make two. Middle school players only get two to make two. Fourth graders only get two to make two. Why did some of the best basketball players in the world need three shots to make two? Rick Barry, Calvin Murphy, and Bill Sharman never needed three to make two.

Freddy Sat Dec 26, 2009 11:46am
Summary of PET PEEVES (from previous post)
 
A Consensus of Non-Fed Signal Pet Peeves
Universal (or nearly so) to Everyone’s Area, Region, Planet, and Universe

1. Upward circling finger when free throw fails to hit the rim
2. Blocking foul signal that looks like the chicken dance
3. Over-the-back signal that looks like Superman flying
4. Timeout signal using a T motion
5. Brushing of palms together to indicate a clean blocked shot
6. Reporting numbers to table with two hands
7. No stop/start clock with raised open hand
8. Directional point angled toward the sky
9. Choppy, short visible counts
10. Double personal foul signal to report a full timeout
11. Thirty second timeout signal pointing thumbs to shoulders with pinkies out
12. Hammering the fists on hips for a blocking foul
13. Travel signal for a throw-in designated spot violation
14. Lazy little fist bump to start the clock
15. Running hand up and down the line to indicate out-of-bounds violation
16. Safe signal to communicate no foul
17. Commonly indicating with two fingers that the goal is for two points, not three
18. Pointing “on the floor” to indicate the player has not started his shooting motion
19. Inbounding and covering side of mouth like coughing when blowing whistle
20. Frankenstein Creeping Death/Zombie signal for “over the back”

Mark Padgett Sat Dec 26, 2009 11:55am
You forgot one.

21. Partner not using any signal at all and allowing game to go into overtime. :mad:

BillyMac Sat Dec 26, 2009 11:59am
You Caught Me Red Fisted ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freddy (Post 645967)
Hammering the fists on hips for a blocking foul.
Guilty. I'm so ashamed. I ran out of gas. I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake. A terrible flood. Locusts. It wasn't my fault, I swear to God. (Apologies to "Joliet Jake", A/K/A, John Belushi)

Do I have to turn in my patch?

26 Year Gap Sat Dec 26, 2009 04:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freddy (Post 645967)
A Consensus of Non-Fed Signal Pet Peeves
Universal (or nearly so) to Everyone’s Area, Region, Planet, and Universe

1. Upward circling finger when free throw fails to hit the rim
2. Blocking foul signal that looks like the chicken dance
3. Over-the-back signal that looks like Superman flying
4. Timeout signal using a T motion
5. Brushing of palms together to indicate a clean blocked shot
6. Reporting numbers to table with two hands
7. No stop/start clock with raised open hand
8. Directional point angled toward the sky
9. Choppy, short visible counts
10. Double personal foul signal to report a full timeout
11. Thirty second timeout signal pointing thumbs to shoulders with pinkies out
12. Hammering the fists on hips for a blocking foul
13. Travel signal for a throw-in designated spot violation
14. Lazy little fist bump to start the clock
15. Running hand up and down the line to indicate out-of-bounds violation
16. Safe signal to communicate no foul
17. Commonly indicating with two fingers that the goal is for two points, not three
18. Pointing “on the floor” to indicate the player has not started his shooting motion
19. Inbounding and covering side of mouth like coughing when blowing whistle
20. Frankenstein Creeping Death/Zombie/Count Dracula signal for “over the back”
which is made worse if the words "Over the back" are used while reporting.

Cobra Sun Dec 27, 2009 03:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freddy (Post 645967)
17. Commonly indicating with two fingers that the goal is for two points, not three
I once worked with a guy who would give the goal counts signal after virtually every goal.

ripcord51 Sun Dec 27, 2009 08:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobra (Post 646124)
I once worked with a guy who would give the goal counts signal after virtually every goal.
I worked with that same guy and what bugged me even more was when he signaled the two it was as if he was celebrating with the player acting like he was part of the accomplishment stopping short of high fiving the player at the same time signaling two over to the table.

ripcord51 Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobra (Post 646124)
I once worked with a guy who would give the goal counts signal after virtually every goal.

I think why every new ref to the game thinks this is so important is because if you watch a Hollywood movie about basketball that includes a basketball official they do this constantly. And act like it is their most important responsibility. See Billy Crystal in Forget Paris or Space Jam.

chseagle Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:15am
Shot-clock violation signal
 
I actually saw an official signal a shot-clock violation by patting both his head & stomach at the same time

fullor30 Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:38am
Pretend like your interested
 
Holiday tournies are special in the Chicago area with many great venues and teams. I reffed in a few so far and watched a few. The other day at a morning game the crew looked like they were in the elephants graveyard, where old, tired bulls go to die. Pet peeve of the day was no mechanics, beckoning of subs consisted of a tired, small finger wave to bring them in as if it was an annoyance to him that he had to do it. They were totally bored, I've seen better interest at a third grade park district game.

Day after Christmas so maybe the all had too much turkey.:(

Rich Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 646145)
Holiday tournies are special in the Chicago area with many great venues and teams. I reffed in a few so far and watched a few. The other day at a morning game the crew looked like they were in the elephants graveyard, where old, tired bulls go to die. Pet peeve of the day was no mechanics, beckoning of subs consisted of a tired, small finger wave to bring them in as if it was an annoyance to him that he had to do it. They were totally bored, I've seem better interest at a third grade park district game.

Day after Christmas so maybe the all had too much turkey.:(
I used to license in Illinois and come down and work some holiday games. We'd always do a morning game at one venue and an afternoon/evening game on the way home. I'll admit, it's hard to get the motor going for a 10AM game. But I know the crews you're talking about -- guys that you'd really worry about if one of the three officials went down with an injury.

BillyMac Sun Dec 27, 2009 01:01pm
Numb3rs Days May Be Numbered ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ripcord51 (Post 646143)
A Hollywood movie about basketball that includes a basketball official.
Watched a "Numb3rs" episode, on CBS, Friday night, that made me want to puke all over the television. Home team is wearing red. Visitors are wearing light blue. Players on both teams are wearing white undershirts. Official calls a technical foul on the "CalSci" coach, but doesn't award free throws. "CalSci" coach wears a whistle during the game. Producers spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on each episode. Why can't they spend a few bucks on a real official to check out the basketball scenes? I should send them my resume.

26 Year Gap Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobra (Post 646124)
I once worked with a guy who would give the goal counts signal after virtually every goal.
That USED to be the mechanic. When I officiated in the 70s you always signaled the number of points to the table. One of the things I had to UNlearn when I got back into officiating after a number of years off.

Adam Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:21pm
Keep moving people, there's no shark here
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 646169)
Watched a "Numb3rs" episode, on CBS, Friday night, that made me want to puke all over the television. Home team is wearing red. Visitors are wearing light blue. Players on both teams are wearing white undershirts. Official calls a technical foul on the "CalSci" coach, but doesn't award free throws. "CalSci" coach wears a whistle during the game. Producers spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on each episode. Why can't they spend a few bucks on a real official to check out the basketball scenes? I should send them my resume.
There's so much to love about Numb3rs as a show; but their basketball scenes are not among them.

There are far more things wrong with it than just what you mention. They bring Jordan Farmar from the Lakers to help stop their losing streak; and nothing is ever mentioned about potential sanctions. The gym itself is far too small for a college gym; hardly any bleachers at all. I'm assuming they were filming in a practice gym at some UC school.

As much as I love the show, they may as well have put David Krumholtz on water skis.

Adam Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 26 Year Gap (Post 646273)
That USED to be the mechanic. When I officiated in the 70s you always signaled the number of points to the table. One of the things I had to UNlearn when I got back into officiating after a number of years off.
I believe, but can't verify, that this was the signal in the early 90's when I got my start working middle school ball in a small college town in Iowa. We also did the whole "cadillac position" thing, too.

Mark Padgett Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 646276)
We also did the whole "cadillac position" thing, too.
You worked wearing fins? :confused:

http://www.caddyman.com.au/images/ma...t/car_fins.gif

fullor30 Sun Dec 27, 2009 09:33pm
Ok, not a mechanic, but what's the deal with the thumbs up somewhat and pinky fingers stuck out as you're running down court. Seems germane to D111 women's officials. Almost like a hook 'em horns but vertical.

Anybody?

26 Year Gap Sun Dec 27, 2009 10:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 646279)
Ok, not a mechanic, but what's the deal with the thumbs up somewhat and pinky fingers stuck out as you're running down court. Seems germane to D111 women's officials. Almost like a hook 'em horns but vertical.

Anybody?
Tea time. Usually used in the UK.

BillyMac Sun Dec 27, 2009 10:58pm
Like The Fonz ???
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 646275)
As much as I love the show, they may as well have put David Krumholtz on water skis.
To jump the shark?

zebraman Mon Dec 28, 2009 02:31am
What is up with the mechanic I see on TV all the time (NCAA Men's games) where the lead official points the other direction after the defensive team gains control of a rebound. Is this a 3rd grade game where we need to remind the players which direction they are going? :rolleyes:

Chess Ref Mon Dec 28, 2009 08:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zebraman (Post 646333)
What is up with the mechanic I see on TV all the time (NCAA Men's games) where the lead official points the other direction after the defensive team gains control of a rebound. Is this a 3rd grade game where we need to remind the players which direction they are going? :rolleyes:
It's to help the coaches keep track.:rolleyes:

Raymond Mon Dec 28, 2009 09:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zebraman (Post 646333)
What is up with the mechanic I see on TV all the time (NCAA Men's games) where the lead official points the other direction after the defensive team gains control of a rebound. Is this a 3rd grade game where we need to remind the players which direction they are going? :rolleyes:
Maybe it's the beginning of their 10-second count.

fullor30 Mon Dec 28, 2009 09:31am
How about the C (or trail in two man) keeping his arm extended signalling number of shots for free throws. After we hopefully communicated verbally and a quick signal, that should be sufficient.

Addendum......have seen leads do it also.

Gargil Mon Dec 28, 2009 09:38am
What about "over the back" when the official pumps both hands like he is reaching over someone's shoulders??

Jurassic Referee Mon Dec 28, 2009 09:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zebraman (Post 646333)
What is up with the mechanic I see on TV all the time (NCAA Men's games) where the lead official points the other direction after the defensive team gains control of a rebound. Is this a 3rd grade game where we need to remind the players which direction they are going? :rolleyes:
I see that one usually after there's a fair amount of contact before the defensive team gets the rebound. I think the idea is that it supposed to show that nobody gained any advantage with the contact and just keep on a-playing. Iow it's basically a message being sent to the other team's coach and maybe to some players on the floor who might want to complain about being fouled. Nothing there...let's move on.

That's my take on it anyhow......

fullor30 Mon Dec 28, 2009 09:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 646372)
I see that one usually after there's a fair amount of contact before the defensive team gets the rebound. I think the idea is that it supposed to show that nobody gained any advantage with the contact and just keep on a-playing. Iow it's basically a message being sent to the other team's coach and maybe to some players on the floor who might want to complain about being fouled. Nothing there...let's move on.

That's my take on it anyhow......
I believe I've heard that also.

grunewar Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:29am
Do as I say, not as I do.....
 
A pet peeve of mine is when sr offiicals, trainers, mentors tell me to do one thing and then either they go out and do the opposite or allow their partners to do it.

Examples - Tweet, tweet, tweet - "Only blow the whistle once;" "You used a team control vice player control foul signal;" reporting to the table using two hands vs Fed one hand; hustling on the court; uniform - shiny shoes, allowing a player to play with a sleeve, not doing a good pre-game, joking or talking too much with with coaches, "When there's a crash, you always must call something;" rarely calling a charge; etc.

I try to be by the book, learn from my mistakes, take what others say and process it - and use what's best. But, don't gig me and then do whatever it is you want to do......

My $.02 and off my soap box.

Rich Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 646372)
I see that one usually after there's a fair amount of contact before the defensive team gets the rebound. I think the idea is that it supposed to show that nobody gained any advantage with the contact and just keep on a-playing. Iow it's basically a message being sent to the other team's coach and maybe to some players on the floor who might want to complain about being fouled. Nothing there...let's move on.

That's my take on it anyhow......
Or it's a signal to reset the shot clock. :D

fullor30 Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by grunewar (Post 646377)
A pet peeve of mine is when sr offiicals, trainers, mentors tell me to do one thing and then either they go out and do the opposite or allow their partners to do it.

Examples - Tweet, tweet, tweet - "Only blow the whistle once;" "You used a team control vice player control foul signal;" reporting to the table using two hands vs Fed one hand; hustling on the court; uniform - shiny shoes, allowing a player to play with a sleeve, not doing a good pre-game, joking or talking too much with with coaches, "When there's a crash, you always must call something;" rarely calling a charge; etc.

I try to be by the book, learn from my mistakes, take what others say and process it - and use what's best. But, don't gig me and then do whatever it is you want to do......

My $.02 and off my soap box.
We have an assignor here who uses the cliche, do as I say, not as I do. I can appreciate that. As you mentioned, just process the comments and apply it to your game.

Forgot the multiple whistle toots..........:(

j51969 Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjones1 (Post 645564)
Here are my signal peeves... he's got some good ones though. :D

YouTube - High-Stress REF

His mullet is awesome!

Adam Mon Dec 28, 2009 11:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by j51969 (Post 646387)
His mullet is awesome!
Now this sentence is a model of redundancy. M&M would be proud.

j51969 Mon Dec 28, 2009 11:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 646395)
Now this sentence is a model of redundancy. M&M would be proud.
I don't get it? You guys need a for dummies manual for the inside stuff, and sarcasm.

bob jenkins Mon Dec 28, 2009 12:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 646279)
Ok, not a mechanic, but what's the deal with the thumbs up somewhat and pinky fingers stuck out as you're running down court. Seems germane to D111 women's officials. Almost like a hook 'em horns but vertical.

Anybody?
Could be "we're in the bonus."

Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 646368)
How about the C (or trail in two man) keeping his arm extended signalling number of shots for free throws. After we hopefully communicated verbally and a quick signal, that should be sufficient.

Addendum......have seen leads do it also.
Lead shouldn't do it, but C needs to communicate with the table after s/he communicates with the L. It shouldn't be held throughout the entire FT, though.

26 Year Gap Mon Dec 28, 2009 12:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by j51969 (Post 646406)
I don't get it? You guys need a for dummies manual for the inside stuff, and sarcasm.
Maybe someday, a guy like Billy Mac will create a guide to long time posters.

Back In The Saddle Mon Dec 28, 2009 02:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by j51969 (Post 646406)
I don't get it? You guys need a for dummies manual for the inside stuff, and sarcasm.
It wouldn't help. It would be written in the same style as everything else here. :D

Back In The Saddle Mon Dec 28, 2009 02:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by zebraman (Post 646333)
What is up with the mechanic I see on TV all the time (NCAA Men's games) where the lead official points the other direction after the defensive team gains control of a rebound. Is this a 3rd grade game where we need to remind the players which direction they are going? :rolleyes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chess Ref (Post 646356)
It's to help the coaches keep track.:rolleyes:
Classic :D

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 646372)
I see that one usually after there's a fair amount of contact before the defensive team gets the rebound. I think the idea is that it supposed to show that nobody gained any advantage with the contact and just keep on a-playing. Iow it's basically a message being sent to the other team's coach and maybe to some players on the floor who might want to complain about being fouled. Nothing there...let's move on.

That's my take on it anyhow......
Same observation, same conclusion.

j51969 Mon Dec 28, 2009 03:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle (Post 646452)
It wouldn't help. It would be written in the same style as everything else here. :D
The Army pays for us to learn other languages. I'll check to see if Pompous is on the list.:rolleyes:

Adam Mon Dec 28, 2009 03:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by j51969 (Post 646460)
The Army pays for us to learn other languages. I'll check to see if Pompous is on the list.:rolleyes:
Wow, it's like you're asking for an Army joke. :)
BTW, check your PM for an explanation.

j51969 Mon Dec 28, 2009 03:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 646462)
Wow, it's like you're asking for an Army joke. :)
BTW, check your PM for an explanation.
Stupid is as stupid does...I work with complete rocks all day long. No matter how many hammers we have, we always have the Marines to make us look good.:D

BillyMac Mon Dec 28, 2009 07:23pm
Maybe An Esteemed Member Will Do It ???
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 26 Year Gap (Post 646413)
Maybe someday, a guy like Billy Mac will create a guide to long time posters.
Sorry, I haven't been around long enough. I still don't understand some of the inside jokes running through this Forum.

BillyMac Mon Dec 28, 2009 07:30pm
It Means "Get Back To The Three Point Arc On Defense" ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zebraman (Post 646333)
What is up with the mechanic I see on TV all the time (NCAA Men's games) where the lead official points the other direction after the defensive team gains control of a rebound. Is this a 3rd grade game where we need to remind the players which direction they are going?
Or, it's the signal I use in my "junior varsity" Catholic middle school games to remind the players that they aren't allowed to press unless it's the fourth period, and there is a ten point or less differential. I'm not an NCAA official, but I'm sure that they have the same no press rule at that level as well.

fullor30 Mon Dec 28, 2009 11:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 646412)
Could be "we're in the bonus."



Lead shouldn't do it, but C needs to communicate with the table after s/he communicates with the L. It shouldn't be held throughout the entire FT, though.
Bob, no, not the bonus hook 'em horns signal, this is the constant pinky curled with thumbs up running down court. I was at Proviso today and a few guys used it, college officials.

Just not used to seeing it either at HS level or D1

Back In The Saddle Tue Dec 29, 2009 12:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by j51969 (Post 646460)
The Army pays for us to learn other languages. I'll check to see if Pompous is on the list.:rolleyes:
That's the language they spoke in Pompeii? :confused: ;)

j51969 Tue Dec 29, 2009 06:28pm
Officials gripping the ball with one hand waiting for a throw in or during a time out. Mainly because my arthritis wont allow me to anymore. :D

fullor30 Tue Dec 29, 2009 07:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by j51969 (Post 646730)
Officials gripping the ball with one hand waiting for a throw in or during a time out. Mainly because my arthritis wont allow me to anymore. :D
That's to impress the young moms in the audience. You know what they about guys with big hands........and it ain't big gloves.

Raymond Wed Dec 30, 2009 08:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by j51969 (Post 646730)
Officials gripping the ball with one hand waiting for a throw in or during a time out. Mainly because my arthritis wont allow me to anymore. :D
Hey, why use 2 hands when 1 will do? :cool:

bob jenkins Wed Dec 30, 2009 09:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 646865)
Hey, why use 2 hands when 1 will do? :cool:
Because some of us can. ;)

Oh, wait --you're talking about holding the basketball. Never mind.

fullor30 Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 646878)
because some of us can. ;)

oh, wait --you're talking about holding the basketball. Never mind.
nice!!!


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