"Providing the Roster"

[bob jenkins]

I don't have my books handy, but a team is issued a T for something like "failing to provide it's roster and 5 starters to the official scorer at least 10 minutes before the start of the game."

What does "provide" mean?

Play: Midway through the third quarter, Visitor 00 enters (otherwise legally) the game. The table buzzes, and indicates that 00 isn't in the book. I asked the table, "What information did the visitors give you to enter in the book?" and the table hands me a printed roster, with no 00. So, I take the sheet to the visitor book (on the bench, not at the table) and ask if that's what they provided. The answer comes, "Yes, and I told the scorer to add 00 to the list." The official scorer denies getting the verbal instruction.

So, did the visitors comply with the rule, or did they earn a T?

[jdw3018]

I don't have my books to read the exact rule, but I'd assess the T in this instance. There certainly is no way for you to know if the verbal instruction was given or not, for one thing, but secondly, I would judge "provide" to mean something more than just "add 00 to the list," especially if it's said in a way that doesn't provide assurance that the player was added.

[jdmara]

I agree with JDW. I think a technical is in order. If they truly said to the scorer "add 00 as well", they should have stayed until 00 was written in the book.

-Josh

[Jeremy Hohn]

If you have the head coaches approve the book's entries before the game, there is NO QUESTION who was in the book and who wasn't.

[knockitoff]

"I told the scorer to add '00' to the book" carries as much weight as "I told my team not to foul."

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Hohn

If you have the head coaches approve the book's entries before the game, there is NO QUESTION who was in the book and who wasn't.

Agreed, but that's not SOP here.

[tjones1]

I would say yes they provided a roster. However, it wasn't a complete roster and if they want 00 to play it's going to cost them a T.

[Back In The Saddle]

"At least 10 minutes before the scheduled starting time, each team shall supply the official scorer with the name and number of each team member and designate the five starting players. Failure to comply results in a technical foul (see 10-1-1 Penalty)."

[JRutledge]

This has always meant to me that they give the information over. It is not anyone's responsibility to make sure it is in the book. That is the scorekeeper's responsibility. In this situation you have to make a decision. If you want to split hair over what was said in conversation then you can do that here. I would hope that most teams would use their team's score book as a guide but that does not always happen. It is just like you have to decide if a mistake in the book is because of the scorekeeper writing down the wrong number of if they were not provided the right information. Bottom line, this is what we get paid the big bucks for.

Peace

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

"At least 10 minutes before the scheduled starting time, each team shall supply the official scorer with the name and number of each team member and designate the five starting players. Failure to comply results in a technical foul (see 10-1-1 Penalty)."

I don't think this answers the question, but merely changes the question from interpreting 'provide' to interpreting 'supply'. Information can be supplied verbally, after all.

I'm in the camp that will assess a T for 00 to enter. The only verifiable info supplied or provided by the visitors was the written lineup. If the visitors complained, I would say, "next time be sure to write your entire lineup."

It would be interesting to know whether 00 was in the visitor's book.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by mbyron

I don't think this answers the question, but merely changes the question from interpreting 'provide' to interpreting 'supply'. Information can be supplied verbally, after all.

I'm in the camp that will assess a T for 00 to enter. The only verifiable info supplied or provided by the visitors was the written lineup. If the visitors complained, I would say, "next time be sure to write your entire lineup."

It would be interesting to know whether 00 was in the visitor's book.

Yes, 00 was in the visitor's book.

[Back In The Saddle]

You're right. It's not an answer. But I figured I'd post the text so everybody didn't have to go look it up.

[SAK]

Did you and your partner count the number of players on each team during warm ups? If so, did the number of players you had agree with the number of players entered into the official score book? If the numbers did agree then you have may a player who is wearing a different number from the one is listed in the book.

Point being, is this something that could have be caught before the 10 minute mark?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Yes, 00 was in the visitor's book.

Interesting.

Often around here we'll see the visitors just hand their book over to the home scorekeeper to copy the lineup. That would have solved the problem.

What did you end up doing?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

You're right. It's not an answer. But I figured I'd post the text so everybody didn't have to go look it up.

Gotcha. I apologize for misinterpreting your italics.