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-   -   back court violation in bounds question (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/55419-back-court-violation-bounds-question.html)

daveg144 Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:55pm

back court violation in bounds question
 
In seven years I've never had a question on this...but now I do.

Team A has possession in the front court. A1 makes an errant pass to A2 and the ball goes into the backcourt. A2 chases it down but doesn't touch it until it is just inside the free throw line (inside the lane). The officials put the ball in play on the sideline, just inside the free throw line (extended). B's coach wanted the ball out of bounds on the baseline, not the sideline.

I've always inbounded the ball on the side after a backcourt violation and after a quick look in the book, I can't find a clear answer.

What do you all say?

sseltser Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:59pm

It's just like any other violation. The violation occurred when the ball was touched by A in the backcourt. Put the ball back in play at the nearest spot to the violation. If the nearest spot is the baseline, then so be it.

BillyMac probably has a myth about the throw-in for a backcourt violation always being at the division line. Right Billy?

Back In The Saddle Sat Nov 14, 2009 11:29pm

According to the "rocket ship" diagram, a violation in the lane results in a base line throw-in.

daveg144 Sat Nov 14, 2009 11:39pm

Thanks for the clarification.

Nevadaref Sun Nov 15, 2009 12:18am

I agree with all of the previous answers, except note that the proper term is END LINE. ;)

Back In The Saddle Sun Nov 15, 2009 01:47am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 636263)
I agree with all of the previous answers, except note that the proper term is END LINE. ;)

I looked for "END LINE. ;)" in the rule book, and couldn't find it. Of course, I couldn't find base line either. :D

Time2Ref Sun Nov 15, 2009 07:23am

1-2: Sidelines, End Lines

Art. 1...The playing court shall be marked with sidelines, end lines and other lines as shown on the appended court diagram........

CMHCoachNRef Sun Nov 15, 2009 08:05am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Time2Ref (Post 636278)
1-2: Sidelines, End Lines

Art. 1...The playing court shall be marked with sidelines, end lines and other lines as shown on the appended court diagram........

When describing the two lines that run perpendicular to the sidelines and running completely from one sideline to the other sideline approximately 4 feet behind the front of the backboard TO A REFEREE OR WHEN CONVERSING WITH A REFEREE use the term "end line."

When discussing these same two lines with a COACH (or most any other basketball person) using the term "baseline" is more common.

Know your audience and speak accordingly.

mbyron Sun Nov 15, 2009 08:40am

I've never had a coach say, "'End line'? What's that?"

BillyMac Sun Nov 15, 2009 09:32am

"The Rocket Ship Diagram" © 2009, Back In The Saddle
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by daveg144 (Post 636254)
I've always inbounded the ball on the side after a backcourt violation and after a quick look in the book, I can't find a clear answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sseltser (Post 636256)
It's just like any other violation. The violation occurred when the ball was touched by A in the backcourt. Put the ball back in play at the nearest spot to the violation. If the nearest spot is the baseline, then so be it. BillyMac probably has a myth about the throw-in for a backcourt violation always being at the division line.

It's not currently on the list, but I'll consider it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle (Post 636259)
According to the "rocket ship" diagram, a violation in the lane results in a base line throw-in.

I've never heard it called the "rocket ship" diagram before, but I like it.
"The Rocket Ship Diagram" © 2009, Back In The Saddle
I could have stolen it, but I didn't, so be sure that I get my 10%.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3582/...70756e11_m.jpg

BillyMac Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:14am

Designated Throw In Spots ...
 
sseltser: I've considered it, and have decided to add it to The Most Misunderstood Basketball Rules list. Congratulations. You are now an official member of the mythbusters. I will soon be sending you your badge, and your secret decoder ring.

http://thm-a02.yimg.com/image/73ad1170ffb738fe

How does this sound guys? Any mistakes? Does this cover most designated throwin spots?

After a violation, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds spot nearest the violation. This is especially true for a backcourt violation, where the ball may not necessarily be put in play at the division line, but, rather, is always put back in play at the spot nearest the violation. After an official's accidental whistle, an interrupted game, a double personal, double technical or simultaneous foul, or some correctable errors, play will be resumed at the point of interruption, i.e., a throwin to the team that was in control at a spot nearest to where the ball was located when the interruption occurred. After an intentional foul, a player control foul, a team control foul, or a common foul before the bonus rule is in effect, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds spot nearest the foul. After a technical foul, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds at the division line opposite the table.

sseltser Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:34am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 636286)
common foul before the bonus rule is in effect, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds spot nearest the foul.

There is an exception to this for a throw-in from anywhere along the endline.

BillyMac Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:45am

Common Foul, No Bonus ???
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sseltser (Post 636287)
There is an exception to this for a throw-in from anywhere along the endline.

Thanks for checking, but I'm not sure what you mean? Remember, this statement refers to a common foul before the bonus rule is in effect. A common foul is a personal foul which is neither flagrant nor intentional nor committed against a player trying or tapping for a field goal nor a part of a double, simultaneous or multiple foul. Example, please.

mbyron Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:56am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 636286)
After a violation, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds spot nearest the violation. This is especially true for a backcourt violation, where the ball may not necessarily be put in play at the division line, but, rather, is always put back in play at the spot nearest the violation. After an official's accidental whistle, an interrupted game, a double personal, double technical or simultaneous foul, or some correctable errors, play will be resumed at the point of interruption, i.e., a throwin to the team that was in control at a spot nearest to where the ball was located when the interruption occurred. After an intentional foul, a player control foul, a team control foul, or a common foul before the bonus rule is in effect, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds spot nearest the foul. After a technical foul, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds at the division line opposite the table.

This is not correct: the point of interruption can be a free throw or an AP arrow throw-in, as per 4-36.

Or perhaps you meant 'e.g.' instead of 'i.e.'...

just another ref Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:05am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 636286)

.......a common foul before the bonus rule is in effect, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throwin from the designated out of bounds spot nearest the foul.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sseltser (Post 636287)
There is an exception to this for a throw-in from anywhere along the endline.


I assume he means that if team A commits a foul while a try is in the air, if the try is successful, team B's throw-in is from anywhere on the end line.


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