Nope - not gonna do it

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by fiasco

It's all about your attitude. If you look at them as crap games, they will always be crap games. That's no one's fault but your own.

When I first started working men's rec, I had no particular attitude about the players, but over the years, the way they played and acted forged my attitude to the point where I just couldn't work them anymore because I was having no fun whatsoever and only annoyance and stress. My experience was that a lot of these guys are trying to prove something to themselves, mostly that the only reason they weren't the star of their old HS team was because the coach had something against them personally - it couldn't possibly be because they weren't a good enough player.

Once it became wreck ball in my mind, I quit working it. As others have said, if it isn't fun, why do it?

[Smitty]

Seriously, knock yourself out. You can have them. I am not interested in training adults to behave properly. It's a waste of my valuable time. I'll stick with the youth games.

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

As others have said, if it isn't fun, why do it?

I agree, but I'm glad I still have fun with it! Maybe I'm still too green to know any better...

How about womens wreck leagues? My experience has been that they don't chirp nearly as much as the men do. Actually, the majority of them played some level of college ball in the 2 womens leagues I work. With the men, most didn't even start for their HS team, let alone college

Originally Posted by Smitty

I'll stick with the youth games.

I'll take those too still 4-6 nights a week for me, no drop off since March.
While I get more atypical situations in youth games, I don't get much above the rim play at that level & the parents (oh boy). "Let 'em play ref" 20 seconds later "somebodys gonna get hurt" gotta love it

Honestly, I get more joy & less grief working adult wreck than youth. But I enjoy seeing the kids have "fun" while they're on the court, so I guess working both in the off-season helps with different aspects of my development. But that's just me, to each his/her own.

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by Smitty

I am not interested in training adults to behave properly. It's a waste of my valuable time.

My job isn't to train anyone. It's to enforce the rules. Maybe that's your problem. You and I look at officiating differently.

Like once when I was doing a Jr High game and I used the resumption-of-play procedure on a girls team who wouldn't come out of their huddle. One of the parents on the front row screamed at me, "Come on, ref, it's your job to teach the girls!"

To which I promptly turned around and said, "On the contrary, sir. That's the coach's job."

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by fiasco

My job isn't to train anyone. It's to enforce the rules. Maybe that's your problem. You and I look at officiating differently.

Like once when I was doing a Jr High game and I used the resumption-of-play procedure on a girls team who wouldn't come out of their huddle. One of the parents on the front row screamed at me, "Come on, ref, it's your job to teach the girls!"

To which I promptly turned around and said, "On the contrary, sir. That's the coach's job."

Now you're just being silly. And you really should stop trying to insult me. You're making yourself look ridiculous. "Maybe that's your problem" is just a stupid thing to say. You're comparing apples to oranges. Give it a rest.

I'm heading to lunch, so feel free to get the last word in. Make it one that really gets me good.

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by Smitty

Now you're just being silly. And you really should stop trying to insult me. You're making yourself look ridiculous. "Maybe that's your problem" is just a stupid thing to say. You're comparing apples to oranges. Give it a rest.

I'm heading to lunch, so feel free to get the last word in. Make it one that really gets me good.

I'm not trying to insult you. I'm just saying that I've never looked at officiating as an opportunity to train players. That's the coaches' jobs. If I was out there to train players, I would have to stop at every whistle and tell little Bobby why he's traveling. That would get annoying after a while.

I can see how looking at officiating in that manner could make you frustrated, though.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by fiasco

I'm just saying that I've never looked at officiating as an opportunity to train players. That's the coaches' jobs.

I had a game last fall in a "competitive" MS league. I was working a 6th grade girls game and made a five second closely guarded call. The coach went nuts and yelled at me, "How are they supposed to know about that rule? They're only in 6th grade."

I looked at him and said, "Most teams have something that teaches their players the rules. It's called a coach. I think you can buy them at Wal-Mart. I'm sure you know where that is, since you apparently buy your clothes there."

He wasn't happy but my partner cracked up.

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

I looked at him and said, "Most teams have something that teaches their players the rules. It's called a coach. I think you can buy them at Wal-Mart. I'm sure you know where that is, since you apparently buy your clothes there."

He wasn't happy but my partner cracked up.

Man, I have got to get a game with you someday! It sounds like your crew has a great time.

I'm sure you know where that is, since you apparently buy your clothes there
Classic

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

I had a game last fall in a "competitive" MS league. I was working a 6th grade girls game and made a five second closely guarded call. The coach went nuts and yelled at me, "How are they supposed to know about that rule? They're only in 6th grade."

I looked at him and said, "Most teams have something that teaches their players the rules. It's called a coach. I think you can buy them at Wal-Mart. I'm sure you know where that is, since you apparently buy your clothes there."

He wasn't happy but my partner cracked up.

Funny, but over the line. I'd never make a personal insult at a coach, no matter how bone headed he/she is. Bad form.

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by fiasco

First nasty look I get is a warning. Second bad behavior is a T, third and you're gone. Any escalation after that and it's "tweet....that's ball game." It actually works really well.

This is training adults to behave properly. They have no coaches. I have no interest in doing this. It's not fun. If you want to jump to a bunch of unsubstantiated conclusions based on my decision to avoid working adult rec ball, that's your prerogative.

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by Smitty

This is training adults to behave properly. They have no coaches. I have no interest in doing this. It's not fun. If you want to jump to a bunch of unsubstantiated conclusions based on my decision to avoid working adult rec ball, that's your prerogative.

Last word, huh?

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

Personally, I believe anybody that can successfully manage a wreck game, can handle most sanctioned games with ease. Your communication & conflict resolution skills are put to the ultimate test with that animal!

I agree with you 100% and that is why I don't understand the disdain for rec ball in this forum. Seeing plays and conflict resolution.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

I had a game last fall in a "competitive" MS league. I was working a 6th grade girls game and made a five second closely guarded call.

Dude.

[Mark Padgett]

I know the terms "competitive" and "6th grade" are incongruous, but that's the terminology the leagues around here use. It's to differentiate the purely recreational leagues from the ones that try to "train" kids to play on HS teams.

For instance, there's two leagues that operate in my city. I'm on the Board of the rec league. We have about 900 kids in grades 3-12 who (most of them, anyway) play for the fun of it. We try to emphasize sportsmanship, fun and fundamentals over competitiveness. We're pretty successful at it, although there's bound to be some exceptions. Some of the "better" players can't afford to play in the other organization so they wind up on one of our teams. Our policy is that any kid who wants to play can play. We even have a "scholarship fund" to help kids from low-income families. No one is flat turned away.

The other league has kids from grades 5-8 and has teams in about six or seven cities in this area. Players are selected at tryouts. It's relatively expensive to play in this (and similar) leagues around here. The emphasis is on winning. I referee in this league, too - and there's a huge difference in the attitude of the parents. In all fairness, most of the coaches are OK with the refs and I've come to know a few of them from working their games over the years. Oh yeah - these guys pay at the game, usually in cash, sometimes by check.