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Old Wed Feb 25, 2009, 02:33pm
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After the buzzer Brawl

This particularly refers to NCAA but has applications for the FED also the general enforcement of rules is similar - however mandatory penalties would be different
here is the E-mail from the NCAAW regional coordinator

“There was an unfortunate incident this past Saturday that needs to be addressed with everyone. We rarely have fights but we all need to know what to do and how to do it in times of high stress. There were no incidents in this game that served as a warning for what was going to happen as the final buzzer was going off. There was a full blown melee with players, substitutes, coaches and fans involved. The officials did not charge anyone with anything on the floor. Their jurisdiction had not ended. They left the court and ended their jurisdiction. Please review the fighting rules so you know what constitutes a fight. Also, please review how to record a fight in the scorebook. This email is not to single this crew out, that part is not important. I believe many officials would have done exactly the same thing. The purpose of this is to get it right if it ever happens again...HOPEFULLY, this is the only fight we will have this season...and hopefully, this email doesn't jinx us all

Here is a response from Debbie Williamson Sec/Rules Editor NCAAW concerning this situation:

The penalties for the fighting (free throws and/or ejection/suspension) rule can only occur when a fight is charged by the officials during the officials jurisdiction (Appendix I- page 141). As you know, the official's jurisdiction doesn't end and the score is not approved until the officials leave the the visual confines of the floor (2-4.4). As long as they still have jurisdiction when a fight occurs, there are penalties to assess. If the officials do not charge anyone with a fight while they still have jurisdiction, then the suspension rules in the rule book cannot be enforced. The officials cannot watch the game film after they leave the court and use that info to apply the basketball rules if they did not charge those people with the fight when they were on the floor. The basketball rules are for the officials to use when they have jurisdiction.
When no fight is charged on the floor, then the conference/governing authority rules (if they have them) will have to penalize the fight because our rules do not allow you to do that. Hope this helps.


"The only rule related issue that I can address from the email below is that officials are to penalize any illegal contact as long as they have jurisdiction. We have defined jurisdiction as being within the visual confines of the court. Officials are not instructed, by rule, to leave as soon as they hear a horn. In fact, Approved Ruling 3 specifically says that "Until the official's jurisdiction ends, an official may call a technical foul, correct a correctable error or correct a bookkeeping mistake by the official scorer. Their may be duties yet to be filled by the officials after the horn sounds.

The rules of basketball provide ample penalties for those who break these rules, but the officials have to enforce the rules that are provided while they have the jurisdiction to do so. Also, it is important for everyone to understand that the basketball rules cannot, nor should, govern what happens to teams/players after a game when the officials did not assess a penalty provided by rules during a game. However, the conference offices and/or individual institutions can choose to govern their own teams/players any way they choose as long as they do not try to lessen a penalty invoked by an official during a game."

Just something to think about to be prepared and hope it never happens to anyone here.
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Old Wed Feb 25, 2009, 02:48pm
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Women's game, right? Was it televised?
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Old Wed Feb 25, 2009, 03:03pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WreckRef View Post
Women's game, right? Was it televised?
I have not been able to determine where it was yet. But I imagine not.
How ever if you are going to say use the tape. That is part of the point,
the conference can impose their own penalties, based on the tape in College.
but if it were high school and there is no tape a player/ coach who should have been ejected can now skate completely because no penaties were imposed by the officials.

Also what if it is a two point game assessed penalties could send you to overtime or change the outcome.
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Old Wed Feb 25, 2009, 03:13pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OHBBREF View Post
I have not been able to determine where it was yet. But I imagine not.
How ever if you are going to say use the tape. That is part of the point,
the conference can impose their own penalties, based on the tape in College.
but if it were high school and there is no tape a player/ coach who should have been ejected can now skate completely because no penaties were imposed by the officials.

Also what if it is a two point game assessed penalties could send you to overtime or change the outcome.
No, no. The point of asking if it was televised was to see if I could find it somewhere, online possibly.

Everybody loves a good cat fight.
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Old Wed Feb 25, 2009, 03:17pm
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Touch wood, I have never had a fight occur in a game I have been officiating.
That said, here is what I think i would do.

I would walk straight over to the scorers table or maybe run, and start cirlcling all players numbers who are involved in the mix up and any who leave the benches.

Let the coaches and security stop the scuffles, this isn't hockey and I'm not a linesman who breaks up fights.

Confer with my paartner(s) who did you see do what? Assess appropriate penalties.

Once in changing area, have the scoresheet brought in and write on the back a condensed version of my report that will go to the AD and my assignor.

Let the league deal with any/all suspensions.
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