Legal pick?

[mu4scott]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I have seen that play several times where the screener does nothing illegal and a fouls should not be called.

Duh... If the screener does nothing wrong then of course it's not a foul. That wasn't the case in this situation.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

It is not about odds, it is about what happen on the play. And the NCAA has used plays like this as an example with legal screens and they did not want a foul.
Peace

Yes we know. If the screen is legal they don't want a foul. It's not rocket science.

BTW I've included a link to a clip from the NCAA mandated clinic where they talk about this.

https://www.eofficials.com/controlpa...ontentID=41128

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by mu4scott

Duh... If the screener does nothing wrong then of course it's not a foul. That wasn't the case in this situation.

Then stop telling people what needs to be called based on the violence of the contact. If it is a foul it is a foul. If it is not, it should be passed on. It is that simple. When you tell people that the violence of the contact has to be addressed and you are sending the wrong message. And that is the point and why I disagree with all this "game management" mess and "the game is going to get out of hand" crap.

BTW, I have seen the referenced and I have attended the meetings as well. I do not need a link to something I have already seen.

Peace

[mu4scott]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Then stop telling people what needs to be called based on the violence of the contact. If it is a foul it is a foul. If it is not, it should be passed on. It is that simple. When you tell people that the violence of the contact has to be addressed and you are sending the wrong message. And that is the point and why I disagree with all this "game management" mess and "the game is going to get out of hand" crap.

BTW, I have seen the referenced and I have attended the meetings as well. I do not need a link to something I have already seen.

Peace

Game management crap??? Hmmm I tend to think it's a very important part of my officiating duties on the floor. Hard fouls can lead to games getting out of hand. At least where I work. It's called retaliation and it's a very common thing.

So like I've said countless times this hard foul needs a whistle not only because it's a foul, but to control the game. That's game management in my book and "crap" in yours I guess.

As far as the link goes we all know you are the Grand Poo-bah of officiating. It was for others who may not have seen it.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by mu4scott

Game management crap??? Hmmm I tend to think it's a very important part of my officiating duties on the floor. Hard fouls can lead to games getting out of hand. At least where I work. It's called retaliation and it's a very common thing.

You do not base game management on one call. And often you do not use game management practices only on what you call once. Did you hear of a fight during this game?

Originally Posted by mu4scott

So like I've said countless times this hard foul needs a whistle not only because it's a foul, but to control the game. That's game management in my book and "crap" in yours I guess.

Then say it is a foul, what might happen as a result is not your concern. And if it is and you know how to officiate the entire game, you might not even need to call another foul. That might be a little over your head (sounds like it). Officials, whom pick one foul out of a game and start talking about game management, are the ones that really do not understand the concept. It is called “game management” not “one call management.”

We have no idea what happen before and no indication that anything got out of hand after the “non-call.” If you have such a link, then feel free to show evidence this game went into the tank (article, foul counts, technical fouls will all do).

Originally Posted by mu4scott

As far as the link goes we all know you are the Grand Poo-bah of officiating. It was for others who may not have seen it.

It is clear you know little or nothing about officiating, or you would not be talking about game management in the context you are. BTW, college officials already are fully aware of the links to these and it has been posted several times on this site. Did you just stumble on the site?

Peace

[mu4scott]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You do not base game management on one call. And often you do not use game management practices only on what you call once. Did you hear of a fight during this game?

You may not be able to base game management on one call, but you can certainly lose it on one call.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Then say it is a foul, what might happen as a result is not your concern. And if it is and you know how to officiate the entire game, you might not even need to call another foul. That might be a little over your head (sounds like it).

Will somebody please translate this for me? I guess it's over my head because I progressed past 5th grade english class. I have no idea what you are saying, but I think it was if I call a foul correctly the players may realize I know how to call that and they won't do it again. Let me write that down in my rule book because I don't see it anywhere.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

It is clear you know little or nothing about officiating, or you would not be talking about game management in the context you are.
Peace

Just imagine how good I'll be once I do learn how to officiate.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by mu4scott

You may not be able to base game management on one call, but you can certainly lose it on one call.

Was there a fight in this game? Did the game get out of hand? It sounds like to me that they got through it without much incident and nothing was called. Funny how things like that take place. (And I am sure that went completely over your head).

Originally Posted by mu4scott

Will somebody please translate this for me? I guess it's over my head because I progressed past 5th grade english class. I have no idea what you are saying, but I think it was if I call a foul correctly the players may realize I know how to call that and they won't do it again. Let me write that down in my rule book because I don't see it anywhere.

I know it is difficult to understand logic for you. You might have progressed pass 5th grade English, but you have not progressed passed Junior High Philosophy. If you cannot understand that this is just one call in one game without trying to add factors the game that are completely irrelevant then you might understand something.

Originally Posted by mu4scott

Just imagine how good I'll be once I do learn how to officiate.

When you realize you can call a foul without all the other BS concerns, then you will learn how to officiate. It either is a foul or it is not a foul. Who gives a damn about the situation on a play like this? Once again, the official on this game passed and I never heard of a game between these two teams turning into a fight. I guess this no-call was good game management.

Peace

[mu4scott]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Was there a fight in this game? Did the game get out of hand? It sounds like to me that they got through it without much incident and nothing was called. Funny how things like that take place. (And I am sure that went completely over your head).


I know it is difficult to understand logic for you. You might have progressed pass 5th grade English, but you have not progressed passed Junior High Philosophy. If you cannot understand that this is just one call in one game without trying to add factors the game that are completely irrelevant then you might understand something.


When you realize you can call a foul without all the other BS concerns, then you will learn how to officiate. It either is a foul or it is not a foul. Who gives a damn about the situation on a play like this? Once again, the official on this game passed and I never heard of a game between these two teams turning into a fight. I guess this no-call was good game management.

Peace

One last time.

1) There was an illegal screen on this play. A whistle should have been blown. The "T" official was in error.

2) From a "Game Management" standpoint I feel this play needed a whistle. I'm not going to pass on fouls like this ever. By passing on this call, this game or any game could have the possibility to get out of hand.

3) Pile on me all you want. I come here to learn, but I'm also not going to back down from what I think is right and what I have learned. My philosophy has worked for me so far and it seems to be right in line w/ others who I pattern my game after.

Not everything is black and white. I'm not going to get into this debate right now, but end of game situations are a glaring example of it.

[canuckrefguy]

Originally Posted by mu4scott

we all know you are the Grand Poo-bah of officiating.

[JRutledge]

I love the Flintstones.

Peace

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by mu4scott

As far as the link goes we all know you are the Grand Poo-bah of officiating. It was for others who may not have seen it.

mu4scott:

Now just wait a gul durn minute!! "I" AM the Grand Poo-bah of basketball officiating. And don't you furgit it!

MTD, Sr.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

mu4scott:

Now just wait a gul durn minute!! "I" AM the Grand Poo of basketball officiating. And don't you furgit it!

MTD, Sr.

Fixed it for ya'.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by mu4scott

Yes we know. If the screen is legal they don't want a foul. It's not rocket science.

No, but when you add completely irrelevant factors to the call like hard screen, tied ball game, player injured, second half, star player, game management, what the coach/players/fans think, etc. etc., you're trying to make it into rocket science.

That's the point that people are trying to get through to you.

[mu4scott]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

No, but when you add completely irrelevant factors to the call like hard screen, tied ball game, player injured, second half, star player, game management, what the coach/players/fans think, etc. etc., you're trying to make it into rocket science.

That's the point that people are trying to get through to you.

Don't put words in my mouth. I never said I gave two cents what fans or players thought. However, I had better be able to explain what I called to a coach on certain plays.

In my opinion you have to be cognizant of your game situation. It's not all black and white all the time. You think those factors are irrelvent, I do not.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by mu4scott

Don't put words in my mouth.

You think those factors are irrelvent, I do not.

The words that came out of your mouth were "hard screen, tied ball game, player injured, second half". If you think that ANY of those factors are relevant in ANY call, so be it.

I won't waste any of your time...or mine...discussing it further.

[mu4scott]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The words that came out of your mouth were "hard screen, tied ball game, player injured, second half". If you think that ANY of those factors are relevant in ANY call, so be it.

I won't waste any of your time...or mine...discussing it further.

Your correct sir those words did come out of my mouth. The other part about fans, player and coaches did not. Some of you like to ad-lib in your rebuttles from time to time.

A no call here was unacceptable. Not only was it a foul. It was a hard screen during a tie ball game in the second half with a player injured in plain view of everyone in the building. Those reasons further accentuate the point as to why a whistle needed to be blown.