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Tue Feb 26, 2002, 01:31pm
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I thought I was the only one that felt I had enough to do without keeping track of the fouls. There have been a couple of times that I knew a player had just committed number 5, but only because I remember calling a couple of fouls on him close together then my partner whistled him. In those situations, I can remember one player, but not everyone.
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I didn't say it was your fault...I said I was going to blame you. 
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Tue Feb 26, 2002, 02:12pm
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Why would you want to know fouls? It's called good game management. Referees are responsible for everything that happens on the floor and if you dont know it will come back and haunt you.
I had a game the other night.. oh my we had the table from well you figure it out. We had to reset the time on the clock twice in the first minute and half. We called the third foul of the game and played awhile longer. The scoreboard showed 1 team foul on each team. At a timeout with 5:30 or so in the quarter I asked the book if there werent two fouls on the visitor. he said no there were only one on each team. I knew there was a foul on both 23 and 21 and told him there were two team fouls. At that point it was a wole lot easier to fix than worrying about correctable errors (BTW the visiting book then stated she had all the fouls) If we would have let it go or not noticed in the second quarter we would have to had fixed it, and maybe even been in a correctable error situation. Official Book shows 6 fouls when there were really 7, home team should shoot 1 and 1 and doesnt... Clock did not start with 2.5 second left in half and home team had ball, I waved off a shot that was going to go in.... Later on the starting center of home team fouls out. I was pretty sure it was his fifth (he deserved it because he wouldnt listen....) He also knew it was his fifth. He picked up a T before the table verified it was his fifth so the coach did not pick up the indirect. Later on in the game we came out of a timeout with about 3 1/2 minutes left in the game score was 48-53. Home scores and the points now show 51-53. Visitor scores a 3 now 51-56. Home scores now 53-56. We have a foul to kill the action. after reporting we took the time to figure out what went wrong. turns out the score should have been 49-53 coming out of the time out. When we verified the scorebooks, both had the identical scores which then matched with the board... You need to know fouls/scoreboard/clocks/etc You need to know what's going on in the game otherwise you are not doing your job
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Tue Feb 26, 2002, 03:00pm
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In IL, the player must be replaced immediately. IMHO, the "experiment" was a success. It could make the rule book next year.
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Tue Feb 26, 2002, 03:18pm
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I thought that the time for a coach to decide on a substitution was 1 minute, but you have cleared me on that one.
I also thought that the ball had to be held for a few second (3, etc...) until it was called a jump... i have one more question to post in a few... thanks...!
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Wed Feb 27, 2002, 11:46am
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"I guess this leads to one of my pet peeves. Get rid of this abomination called alternating possession. FIBA and NBA/WNBA uses the jump ball to put the ball into play for all held balls."
This is DEFINITELY a sign that the Apocalypse is upon us. Mr.D and I having the same thoughts on an issue.   
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Wed Feb 27, 2002, 12:23pm
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I've recently had another "Old Guy" tell me that if you call the 5th...after reporting, get out of dodge and have the other official notify the coach and get the sub. Reasoning is that since "you" fouled the kid out, Mr. coach in some cases may not be happy with you per say. Whats your take? Larks - VIT
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Wed Feb 27, 2002, 12:32pm
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If you think there's any kind of controversey, then let your partner handle it.
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Wed Feb 27, 2002, 12:59pm
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Here is a matrix for what's right to know and what's wrong regarding foul counts. Of course, I am always right
Right: knowing the team foul count Wrong: letting anyone, including your partner, know that you know the number of fouls on any individual player Wrong: letting your knowledge of either team or individual fouls influence your calls in any way Gray area: actually knowing the number of fouls on any individual player Personally - I try to stay away from that gray area because someone might find out and that's a "wrong"
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Yom HaShoah
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Wed Feb 27, 2002, 02:39pm
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I've recently had another "Old Guy" tell me that if you call the 5th...after reporting, get out of dodge and have the other official notify the coach and get the sub. Reasoning is that since "you" fouled the kid out, Mr. coach in some cases may not be happy with you per say. Whats your take? Larks - VIT [/B][/QUOTE]Larks,my take is that you couldn't get any better advise than what Bob Jenkins recommended in his post!
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Wed Feb 27, 2002, 03:07pm
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That's actually the approved mechanic in Louisiana. LHSAA's Mac Chauvin has come out and said the off call official will notify the coach and then then the player of the 5th foul. Bob has the reason down pat. Since that's where I cut my referee teeth, I thought it was strange that everybody else didn't do that
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Good preventive officiating to remind the coach to get his butt in gear,though.
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