What do we have here?

[ma_ref]

Originally Posted by Ref in PA

by the time the signal is started by the ref, the shooter is clearly in the act. In fact, the shot is away before the ref completes the signal.

Agree with previous poster. Signal/whistle has nothing to do with this at all. Our whistle is only there to tell the timer to stop the clock, and our hand signals are a visual cue for the benefit of everybody to know what's going on.

For sake of argument, let's say the coach dropped the f-bomb on the trail in the video. Trail raises hand, blows whistle, T-signal. Now trail has to determine whether or not shooting motion started before f-bomb. If I were trail in this case, and that was the defensive coach, it appears in the video as though some kind of shot was immenent, so I'd hold off for a second for the offense to get a shot, wait to see if it goes - to avoid any timing confusion, then blow my whistle and bang him with a T. If that coach is on the offense, I blow my whistle immediately, wave off the shot, and throw the T.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by ma_ref

Agree with previous poster. Signal/whistle has nothing to do with this at all. Our whistle is only there to tell the timer to stop the clock, and our hand signals are a visual cue for the benefit of everybody to know what's going on.

For sake of argument, let's say the coach dropped the f-bomb on the trail in the video. Trail raises hand, blows whistle, T-signal. Now trail has to determine whether or not shooting motion started before f-bomb. If I were trail in this case, and that was the defensive coach, it appears in the video as though some kind of shot was immenent, so I'd hold off for a second for the offense to get a shot, wait to see if it goes - to avoid any timing confusion, then blow my whistle and bang him with a T. If that coach is on the offense, I blow my whistle immediately, wave off the shot, and throw the T.

According to the case book that is exactly what you are supposed to do when the opposing team offends during a scoring play.

[ma_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

According to the case book that is exactly what you are supposed to do when the opposing team offends during a scoring play.

Phew...good to know I'm doing the right thing. If you blow the whistle right away, I see it as penalizing the offense for the stupidity of a defensive coach. True, they are getting 2 shots and the ball, but it's not like T's are accidentally earned. Good basket...2 shots...ball at mid-court...maybe that'll teach the coach to shut up next time.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by ma_ref

Phew...good to know I'm doing the right thing. If you blow the whistle right away, I see it as penalizing the offense for the stupidity of a defensive coach. True, they are getting 2 shots and the ball, but it's not like T's are accidentally earned. Good basket...2 shots...ball at mid-court...maybe that'll teach the coach to shut up next time.

Yep, here's the citation:

WITHHOLD WHISTLE
10.4.1 SITUATION E: A1 is driving toward the basket for an apparent goal when the official, while trailing the play advancing in the direction in which the ball is being advanced, is cursed by the head coach of Team B. How should the official handle this situation? RULING: The official shall withhold blowing the whistle until A1 has either made or missed the shot. The official shall then sound the whistle and assess the Team B head coach with a technical foul. If the official judges the act to be flagrant, the coach shall be ejected and shall leave the vicinity of the playing area and have no further contact (direct or indirect) with the team. If A's coach was the offender, the whistle shall be sounded immediately when the unsporting act occurs.

[ma_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Yep, here's the citation:

Thanks for the casebook entry. I actually got fooled by this during my 2nd year of officiating. I was working a summer AAU tournament, don't remember the score, but I think it must've been close at the time. Team A is in their front court passing the ball around, B1 steals the ball from A1, and is on a breakaway towards the basket for an easy lay-up. Coach from A1 starts screaming at me about why I didn't call a foul on the steal and wouldn't let up, so I hit him with a T...before B1 had a chance to score. After the game, the coach comes up to me and with a sly grin tells me "No hard feelings about the T...I just didn't want that kid to get the easy 2 points." Fortunately that basket didn't matter 1 way or the other, but man did I feel foolish because he tricked me...Oh well, live and learn I suppose...