Side-line coverage in two-man

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by mick

We're free to "move to improve", but what you are suggesting seems to hint that we may be uncovering the endline and the division line because Lead stepped up annd Trail closed down.

If I am seeing this correctly, there will be no officials for possible line violations during a particularly stressful situation for the player who has a ball that he doesn't want anymore.

Actually what I'm saying is just like the movement of trail and lead in a 4 corners stall. Trail would be working like a high C, off the side, closer to the arch.

Lead isn't coming all the way up, they are moving from the endline to about 3 feet above it on the sideline. They will get the same look trail would get from coming over without leaving the entire other half of the court uncovered. Plus you have the look at OOB now without needing help. Also a pass out of the trap doesn't require a 20 foot adjustment by trail, but means lead turning the corner and moving about 6 feet.

[mick]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

Actually what I'm saying is just like the movement of trail and lead in a 4 corners stall. Trail would be working like a high C, off the side, closer to the arch.

Lead isn't coming all the way up, they are moving from the endline to about 3 feet above it on the sideline. They will get the same look trail would get from coming over without leaving the entire other half of the court uncovered. Plus you have the look at OOB now without needing help. Also a pass out of the trap doesn't require a 20 foot adjustment by trail, but means lead turning the corner and moving about 6 feet.

But the Lead may not have a very good look from one-step above the endline.
In order to trap, a defender probably has sealed of the sideline, that the Lead is watching, and the defender's back will be toward the Lead. Lead will be unable to see through the defender(s) and since we have moved Trail away and less able to see any illegal contact. We have nobody on ball.

Even in a stall machanic, the Trail is advised to follow the ball away from his sideline.

[Kelvin green]

My 2 cents..

Ball is in Trail's primary. Trail has primary coverage of the ball and needs to do whatever to properly officiate the play and get it right.

Lead is watching off ball since Trail is watching ball

Ball goes OOB as trail is watching play, simple call for Trail.

Ball goes OOB as lead is watching off ball, lead has no idea what happened, difficult call for trail.

where I am from ball goes OOB above FT line extended Trail has first shot at the OOB on any OOB play...

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by mick

But the Lead may not have a very good look from one-step above the endline.
In order to trap, a defender probably has sealed of the sideline, that the Lead is watching, and the defender's back will be toward the Lead. Lead will be unable to see through the defender(s) and since we have moved Trail away and less able to see any illegal contact. We have nobody on ball.

Even in a stall machanic, the Trail is advised to follow the ball away from his sideline.

Unless trail comes all the way across to the opposite sideline, they are looking through a defender in a trap too. In 2 person you always have a hole, you always have the possibility of a less than perfect look, you always have to trade one coverage area for another.

Your way:

Lead cheats to the sideline to blow OOB, leaving them away from the paint and off ball with a distant look and poor angle.

Trail leaves their sideline uncovered, has to work inside out, leaving lead with all the remaining players.

My way:

Lead gets a similar view to trail coming over, has their sideline for OOB, is close enough to officiate the endline, and if there is room, can take a step off the court on the sideline to get a better look at the play and still be open to some off ball.

Trail has their lines covered, can move to get a good look off ball, and is in a better position to move on a pass out of the trap or on a steal and transition.

[FrankHtown]

The Trail has to get to the sideline and perhaps out of bounds to officiate the play. One good reason is if it's tableside, the coaches are going to get a better look at the play than the Trail if he/she stays at midcourt, even if he/she goes into the backcourt. And yes, the trail has to leave his/her sideline uncovered, but you're trading off missing a potential foul, to the risk that the trapped player is going to fling the ball 45 feet to the far sideline. Even if that happens, the trail has an unobscured look to see who it goes off of, if the Trail is at the sideline or OOB. And if the Lead is really awake, he/she will rotate over to balance the floor.

Get where you need to be to see the play.

(Disclaimer: Damien and I go to the same camps. )

[Kelvin green]

Not sure how you think lead has a "similar view". Lead watching this play will see nothing on a trap. Will be most likely straightlined and have no angles... That being said...

Think about the distances on a basketball court

If trail is standing at middle of court. That is 25' from either sideline. If ball is 3 ft from half court it is 39" from the base line (84 ft floor) but based on simple math is less than 26' from trail... For lead to referee this play and get the same distance you would have to step up to top of highest lane space.

On a 94' floor the distance is still the same for trail (less than 26ft if standing just a mid court) for lead to have same distance 26 ft to the 44 ft line from the baseline you would have to step up to the FT Line to get same distance to make call...

The reason FT Line extended is the division between primaries is that the FT line extended is about the mathematical break even point. If trail steps just 6' to opposite side line (two-three steps) he is just over 19ft from any play in that area.

The notion that "trail's sideline" is some how left open makes liitle sense. If it is a skip pass, trail is watching the ball most likely anyway. If it works its way over, trail works way over.

If for some strange reason it gets dumped into a low post and ricochets off a player to the far sideline I am sure lead can help out since lead most likely saw it...No difference than trail helping out on a ball going OOB on lead's sideline when lead goes strong side....

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

Not sure how you think lead has a "similar view". Lead watching this play will see nothing on a trap. Will be most likely straightlined and have no angles... That being said...

Think about the distances on a basketball court

If trail is standing at middle of court. That is 25' from either sideline. If ball is 3 ft from half court it is 39" from the base line (84 ft floor) but based on simple math is less than 26' from trail... For lead to referee this play and get the same distance you would have to step up to top of highest lane space.

On a 94' floor the distance is still the same for trail (less than 26ft if standing just a mid court) for lead to have same distance 26 ft to the 44 ft line from the baseline you would have to step up to the FT Line to get same distance to make call...

The reason FT Line extended is the division between primaries is that the FT line extended is about the mathematical break even point. If trail steps just 6' to opposite side line (two-three steps) he is just over 19ft from any play in that area.

The notion that "trail's sideline" is some how left open makes liitle sense. If it is a skip pass, trail is watching the ball most likely anyway. If it works its way over, trail works way over.

If for some strange reason it gets dumped into a low post and ricochets off a player to the far sideline I am sure lead can help out since lead most likely saw it...No difference than trail helping out on a ball going OOB on lead's sideline when lead goes strong side....

We are discussing a trap NEAR FT LINE EXTENDED not near the division line. Lead in my mechanic is 10-12 feet away not 39.

So Trail is on the opposite sideline officiating the trap and there is a skip pass to behind the 3 point line in their corner...yeah, they will get a great look at that play.

[Kelvin green]

OP said "about the middle of their front court" That is not FT Line extended in my book middle of the fromt court would be 4-5 ft above FT Line... and lead still has a terrible look

If there is skip pass to the opposite corner, trail can cover within a few steps... lead can help...

What's the difference here than when lead goes strong side and there is a quick pass and it goes up from lead's corner? (on the weak side) ... Not much at all...

[BillyMac]

Boundary Responsibilities:

New IAABO "Option":
Lead’s Boundary Responsibilities: Nearest Endline And Sideline Below Free Throw Line Extended
Trail’s Boundary Responsibilities: Division Line, All The Backcourt, Nearest Endline, Farther Sideline Above Feee Throw Line Extended
Note: Even though it's listed as an "Option", no other guidelines, or diagrams, are listed in the IAABO Mechanics Manual.

Old NFHS:
Lead’s Boundary Responsibilities: Nearest Endline And Nearest Sideline
Trail’s Boundary Responsibilities: Nearest Sideline, Division Line, Back Endline

New NFHS:
I don't have a new NFHS Mechanics Manual. Our IAABO Handbook contains an IAABO Directory, NFHS Rules, NFHS Casebook, and only an IAABO Mechanics Manual.

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

OP said "about the middle of their front court" That is not FT Line extended in my book middle of the fromt court would be 4-5 ft above FT Line... and lead still has a terrible look

If there is skip pass to the opposite corner, trail can cover within a few steps... lead can help...

What's the difference here than when lead goes strong side and there is a quick pass and it goes up from lead's corner? (on the weak side) ... Not much at all...

Mick brought up near FT line extended and he and I were having the discussion before you butted in...perhaps next time you'll actually READ the thread before you take exception.

Lead going ball-side should only occur when there are post players on that side with the ball on or nearing the wing. Going any other time is stupid and asking for trouble...IOW, exactly the situation you described.

[Rich]

It's easy for the trail to pick this up when the ball goes out of bounds hard up high.

But what about when the ball is close to the sideline and the ball is tapped loose and it is either on or near but not on the division line. The trail has no prayer on this one.

As the lead, I try to be as wide as the ball, knowing I have sideline coverage. I work off ball, but know that the ball is near the side line. When there's pressure, I shift focus to take an out of bounds play if necessary, and keep my peripheral in the post. In this one situation, the on ball pressure takes priority over the off ball play in the post.

I know that Referee has recommended the FT line delineation for coverage, but my regular partners and I are definitely old school in this area. The only time I get involved as the trail is if the lead is unaware that the ball shot out of bounds, then I'll jump in with a whistle/signal.

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by Bearfanmike20

Diagrams please... some of us are visual people

Think of it this way - mentally divide the width of the court into 3 zones that run the entire length of the court, see diagram below (solid lines are the side lines):

__________________________________________________ _____________

A

------------------------------------------------------------------------

B

------------------------------------------------------------------------

C

__________________________________________________ _____________

Trail should move so that they are never more than one zone away from the ball. In the OP, assume trail's side line is the top & lead's the bottom. If ball is in A or B, trail is in A, but if ball moves across court to C, trail should move into B, even as far as the imaginary line between B&C to get best angle on the action. Lead's sideline is still their responsibility and they need to slide out along the end line to cover it when the ball is over there.

The bottom line is that in 2 man especially, you both need to be ready to move to both cover your area of responsibility and get the best angle on the play, and when necessary do so decisively. Sometimes it means closing down or even going ball side, others it means backing out to open up the angles to get a better view of the whole play.

Hope this helps!

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by mick

That can work on a small court, but maybe not on a larger court.
It sorta depends on where the the trap is applied.
If the trap is near the division line, going backcourt makes lotsa sense. Conversely, if the trap is near free throw line extended we may not see much.

But ya, don't let any moss be growin' under yer feet. There ain't no fixed restrictions on where an official can be.

Mick, I agree with what you stated.

My reply was towards the trap occurring above the free-throw line more towards the division. In the event, it is FTL extended you would have to work hard to get a good peek.

[Kelvin green]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

Mick brought up near FT line extended and he and I were having the discussion before you butted in...perhaps next time you'll actually READ the thread before you take exception.

Lead going ball-side should only occur when there are post players on that side with the ball on or nearing the wing. Going any other time is stupid and asking for trouble...IOW, exactly the situation you described.

Like getting personal? I did read the whole thread but missed the one threat you mentioned FT Line extended... sorry!

Lead goes strong side and picks up the low post because ball is over there and it never gets kicked to opposite sideline for a three? Giive me a break. All I said was the coverage that you indict because trail could not cover it was no different that any other strong side (where both officials are of the same side of floor) ...

I never addressed when lead goes strong side. Maybe you should actually read the post.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by TimTaylor

Think of it this way - mentally divide the width of the court into 3 zones that run the entire length of the court. Trail should move so that they are never more than one zone away from the ball. The bottom line is that in 2 man especially, you both need to be ready to move to both cover your area of responsibility and get the best angle on the play, and when necessary do so decisively. Sometimes it means closing down or even going ball side, others it means backing out to open up the angles to get a better view of the whole play.

TimTaylor: Great post. Young officials, please take note.

Here in Connecticut we are taught similar ABC mechanics, however, we have been encouraged to occassionally move slightly into the third zone, especially in trapping situations in the far corner from the trail, against the divison line. In other words, in such a trapping situation, the trail may go from C, into B, slightly into A, and possibly move slightly into the backcourt, to, as you said, "backing out to open up the angles to get a better view of the whole play".