T Worth, Part II or Deja Vu All Over Again.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

I had a similar situation tonight.

Two-man officiating crew. Team H is up by four late in the second quarter. I am L, table side. V1 attempts field two-point field goal attempt from the weak side; the attempt is successful. H1 and V2 are in front of me and during the V1's attempt, H1 pushes V2 out of the way to get a better position for a possible rebound. I call the foul on H1. H1 is not happy and neither is H-HC. H1's foul puts Team V into the double bonus. I report H1's foul and now the fun begins.

Just as I finish reporting the foul, H1 walks by me and tells me in a voice loud enough for the players standing near me, that I had made a "horrible call." WHACK No. 1; I calming tell H1 that is conduct is an unsportsmanlike TF. I then turn to H-HC, who is standing in Team H's coaching box about fifteen feet away from me, and inform him that H1 has received an unsportsmanlike TF and why he had received it. At that point H-HC tells me in a lvoice loud enough for everybody on Team H's bench and the players on the court in front of the bench: "Because it was a horrible call." WHACK No. 2. I calmly tell him that he has received an unsportsmanlike TF and that he as lost the coaching box for the rest of the game. He never complained the rest of the game and never lifted his tuchus off the bench unless the rules allowed it. SUPRISE! SUPRISE!

Team V makes all six free throws to go from four to four up (thanks to the successful FG attempt by V1 to start the play. The second quarter ends with Team V up by four. Team V loses the game by twenty. LOL

MTD, Sr.

[Bad Zebra]

If nothing else, thank you for spelling "tuchus". Always wondered how it was spelled...I'm not even sure if that's the correct spelling, but thanks for the effort.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Bad Zebra

If nothing else, thank you for spelling "tuchus". Always wondered how it was spelled...I'm not even sure if that's the correct spelling, but thanks for the effort.

Bad Zebra:

Tuchus is the correct spelling and I am glad I was able to brighten your day.

MTD, Sr.

[tomegun]

Where was your partner during all this? Personally, I don't stick around to tell a coach he/she has lost the box - I let one of my partners do that. Don't get me wrong, if warranted, I have no problem giving a coach two Ts, but I will not wait around and possibly open up the possibility of another T.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Where was your partner during all this? Personally, I don't stick around to tell a coach he/she has lost the box - I let one of my partners do that. Don't get me wrong, if warranted, I have no problem giving a coach two Ts, but I will not wait around and possibly open up the possibility of another T.

TomeGun:

I agree but my my conversation went very quickly: "Coach, that's an unsportsmanlike TF, you have lost the coaching box for the rest of the game." He just went silent; no complaining, just sat his tuchus on the bench and never said word about the officiating the rest of the game. He had been chipping some before the incident. He didn't stand up while I was reporting the two TF's at the Table. It was like the TF took all of the wind out of his sails with regard to complaining about the officiating. If only it were this easy all of the time.

MTD, Sr.

[tjones1]

Sounds like you had a fun night, Mark.

I've certainly got a tea and crumpets party here. And I'm bringing the tea...

Sounds like he was trying to fire up his team. Looks like it worked.

[Back In The Saddle]

Wouldn't that be an unsporting TF?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

Wouldn't that be an unsporting TF?

This isn't soccer.

MTD, Sr.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

I then turn to H-HC, who is standing in Team H's coaching box about fifteen feet away from me, and inform him that H1 has received an unsportsmanlike TF and why he had received it.

Why did you do this?

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

TomeGun:

I agree but my my conversation went very quickly: "Coach, that's an unsportsmanlike TF, you have lost the coaching box for the rest of the game." He just went silent; no complaining, just sat his tuchus on the bench and never said word about the officiating the rest of the game. He had been chipping some before the incident. He didn't stand up while I was reporting the two TF's at the Table. It was like the TF took all of the wind out of his sails with regard to complaining about the officiating. If only it were this easy all of the time.

MTD, Sr.

Do you think it is OK to send this message to any young official who might look at this thread? How many times has it been said, if you T a coach get away. I'm not saying run away even if the coach still continues with the same behavior, but what you said to the coach should have been said by your partner, IMO. It worked for you this time, but this isn't really a good practice to continue.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Do you think it is OK to send this message to any young official who might look at this thread? How many times has it been said, if you T a coach get away. I'm not saying run away even if the coach still continues with the same behavior, but what you said to the coach should have been said by your partner, IMO. It worked for you this time, but this isn't really a good practice to continue.

tomegun:

I am not going to take the bait. I stand by my previous statements as a general principle. This interaction happened so fast that my partner wouldn't have had a chance to intervene and the coach's demeanor completely changed once I told him he had received a TF. Instead of making more comments he went absolutely silent and made a bee-line for the bench. The coach had his tuchus on the bench before I could finish telling he had lost the bench. I have a feeling that he might have been tossed earlier in the season and a second ejection would have meant he would have been automatically suspended for the rest of the seaon including the post-season tournemant.

MTD, Sr.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

tomegun:

I am not going to take the bait. I stand by my previous statements as a general principle. This interaction happened so fast that my partner wouldn't have had a chance to intervene and the coach's demeanor completely changed once I told him he had received a TF. Instead of making more comments he went absolutely silent and made a bee-line for the bench. The coach had his tuchus on the bench before I could finish telling he had lost the bench. I have a feeling that he might have been tossed earlier in the season and a second ejection would have meant he would have been automatically suspended for the rest of the seaon including the post-season tournemant.

MTD, Sr.

I don't know what bait you are talking about.
Your situation worked out for you. What I'm talking about is the other 99% of the time where it will not work that way and you should give the T and move away. What would you advise a younger official to do? I would say give the T and move away. What about you?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I don't know what bait you are talking about.
Your situation worked out for you. What I'm talking about is the other 99% of the time where it will not work that way and you should give the T and move away. What would you advise a younger official to do? I would say give the T and move away. What about you?

tomegun:

What have I always said: Get away from the coach. Having said that, there are times (and these times are very few and far between) when bald old geezers, like me and JR and Tony and Rut and The Preacher and Nevada Ref and Cameron and Chuck and a number of other esteemed members of this Board can get away with something like this. Remember: This was the one in a million play that was the exception to the rule. Get over it. You are making a mountain out of a speed bump.

MTD, Sr.

[tomegun]

Well, I know Chuck and Nevada and I've seen Rut on video. None of them are bald old geezers. I think it is funny that you have to mention all those other officials - seems like you need some backup!
If you would have said what you did was something that happens "very few and far between" to begin with you wouldn't have heard a peep from me. I think I've been around the block enough times to realize that something I can do shouldn't be relayed to a younger official. If you would have communicated that from the beginning you wouldn't be getting all defensive on a Sunday afternoon. Maybe you should get over yourself and then you wouldn't have to bring others into an argument that you yourself said doesn't happen often (very few and far between).
Now that you have (finally) admitted that what you did is rare, we can end the discussion unless you want to comment further. It was never for my benefit anyway since I knew as soon as I saw your post that it was wrong to communicate that.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Well, I know Chuck and Nevada and I've seen Rut on video. None of them are bald old geezers. I think it is funny that you have to mention all those other officials - seems like you need some backup!
If you would have said what you did was something that happens "very few and far between" to begin with you wouldn't have heard a peep from me. I think I've been around the block enough times to realize that something I can do shouldn't be relayed to a younger official. If you would have communicated that from the beginning you wouldn't be getting all defensive on a Sunday afternoon. Maybe you should get over yourself and then you wouldn't have to bring others into an argument that you yourself said doesn't happen often (very few and far between).
Now that you have (finally) admitted that what you did is rare, we can end the discussion unless you want to comment further. It was never for my benefit anyway since I knew as soon as I saw your post that it was wrong to communicate that.

Wrong to communicate what?

MTD, Sr.