Fight?

[RCBSports]

Hey, I just had this game where I fight almost broke out, however I had a question.

If a fight did break out, as a ref, I would stand down and wait and observe. However, for my high school, I am the student athletic trainer and I was wondering if a fight would break out, could I go out and try to stop the fight; more in the sense of pushing the players back to the bench.

Would I get a "T" or not? I would never encourage a fight, I would be the one to stop it. Most people at the place also knows me as the person who always discourages fights and will do anything in my power to end the fight. Anyway, what's the ruling or would it be in an opinion/judgment call?

Thanks

[johnnyrao]

I do not have my rule book handy, but I think, in this instance, you are considered "bench personnel", no different from team members not in the game. Therefore, the rules apply to you for leaving the bench area during a fight.

[johnnyrao]

Just checked the NCAA rule book. You would be considered "bench personnel" and if you leave the bench area for a fight you would be ejected. If, in the opinion of the officials, you participate in the fight, you would be assessed a direct technical and ejected. It also counts as in indirect for the HC. I think it's the same in NFHS but someone else can verify with the rule book.

[RCBSports]

Originally Posted by johnnyrao

Just checked the NCAA rule book. You would be considered "bench personnel" and if you leave the bench area for a fight you would be ejected. If, in the opinion of the officials, you participate in the fight, you would be assessed a direct technical and ejected. It also counts as in indirect for the HC. I think it's the same in NFHS but someone else can verify with the rule book.

Ok, I thought that; now what if I am not on the bench. Normally I am hanging out with the Administrative of the school and I saw a fight break out. If I go out, would the team still get a T?

[Coltdoggs]

Originally Posted by RCBSports

Hey, I just had this game where I fight almost broke out, however I had a question.

If a fight did break out, as a ref, I would stand down and wait and observe. However, for my high school, I am the student athletic trainer and I was wondering if a fight would break out, could I go out and try to stop the fight; more in the sense of pushing the players back to the bench.

Would I get a "T" or not? I would never encourage a fight, I would be the one to stop it. Most people at the place also knows me as the person who always discourages fights and will do anything in my power to end the fight. Anyway, what's the ruling or would it be in an opinion/judgment call?

Thanks

From your post, it sounds as if the fight was between players? As a ref, you can't stand down and observe...this is not hockey and we wait till they hit the ice..

[RCBSports]

Originally Posted by Coltdoggs

From your post, it sounds as if the fight was between players? As a ref, you can't stand down and observe...this is not hockey and we wait till they hit the ice..

Well, I heard one of our board members saying that if you are ref and fight break outs, stand down. Don't attempt to break it up, let security do that. Now if I see a fight about to break out, I do step in and interfer. I will stand in between them and tell them to cool it; normally advising the coach to take action.

I dunno, I will ask the board and see what protocols they have for the situation.

Thanks

[Coltdoggs]

Originally Posted by RCBSports

Well, I heard one of our board members saying that if you are ref and fight break outs, stand down. Don't attempt to break it up, let security do that. Now if I see a fight about to break out, I do step in and interfer. I will stand in between them and tell them to cool it; normally advising the coach to take action.

I dunno, I will ask the board and see what protocols they have for the situation.

Thanks

I'd have to verify that with some of the vets...but like you, I'm inclined to stepping in to break it up....that's just me and at the end of the day, they are just kids. That's my court and I'm responsible for what goes on out there...

Had a JRHS tourney a few weeks back and a kid from the losing team approached the other bench after they slapped hands after the game...I guess somebody from the winning team said something and this kid took exception...It was right in front of me and I stepped in, bear hugged the kid and moved him away while explaining to him that he didn't really want to follow through with what he thought he did.....I think my words sunk in quick as he said "your right" and went back to his own bench area away from the other team.

[tomegun]

For me it depends. First of all, your whistle is a tool during situations like this. Blowing your whistle several times in someone's ear is very annoying and could end the situation. Other than that, if the fight is in full swing I would be hesitant to jump in to break it up. However, given the right circumstance this is my opportunity to grab a trouble-maker and see how far I can toss him! J/K

[Coltdoggs]

Originally Posted by tomegun

For me it depends. First of all, your whistle is a tool during situations like this. Blowing your whistle several times in someone's ear is very annoying and could end the situation. Other than that, if the fight is in full swing I would be hesitant to jump in to break it up. However, given the right circumstance this is my opportunity to grab a trouble-maker and see how far I can toss him! J/K

You used to compete in the midget toss contests didn't you Tome!

[deecee]

we do 2 man here -

if a fight actually breaks out and 2 teams are going at it all you can do as an official is sit back and take note of who throws punches and who leaves the bench. Let the coaches and game management get the fight under control.

The only time I step between is in the time before something happens when there still is a chance to cool things off.

I would usually cover one team and my partner would cover the rest -- once the dust settles we would have to come together and decide who is getting tossed and how we move forward.

What else can we do -- jump in the middle of the fracas to try and break it up -- who then will take note of the benches and players involved?

[Coltdoggs]

Originally Posted by deecee

we do 2 man here -

if a fight actually breaks out and 2 teams are going at it all you can do as an official is sit back and take note of who throws punches and who leaves the bench. Let the coaches and game management get the fight under control.

The only time I step between is in the time before something happens when there still is a chance to cool things off.

I would usually cover one team and my partner would cover the rest -- once the dust settles we would have to come together and decide who is getting tossed and how we move forward.

What else can we do -- jump in the middle of the fracas to try and break it up -- who then will take note of the benches and players involved?

When put this way...I can take the position of sitting back...I guess I hadn't really disected the whole thing and what would have to happen after the fight was brokent up...

[ca_rumperee]

... when and if a fight breaks out while I'm officiating I will stand back and watch -- taking numbers.

Question: Should the first thing I do once things break out is summon coaches? It seems they will have an inherent ability to get their players under control and that I would want them there to break things up. If I don't summon them, they risk ejection if they had any 'priors' during the game, right?

Or, can I fall back on an 'assumed' summoning of personnel to quell.

So, say Coach from Team A received a technical in the first half for some chirping related incident. In the 2nd half, Players A1 and B1 tangle near mid-court. Both coaches rush out and grab their players to prevent escalation.

I did not summon them onto the court. I would assess double flagrant fouls on A1 and B1. They are gone. I could assess Technical fouls on the coaches for coming onto the floor, even though their presence was critical lets say for keeping things from escalating. Or could we get together and say that we did summon them, or choose to ignore. (btw - these both sound like a cop out)

So my question is, do I want coaches out quickly in this situation, and if so, is the default move, while stepping aside to observe, to summon coaches??

Vort.

[deecee]

once an altercation has begun and a coach runs out to break it up-- whether I actually summon a coach or not -- I consider him on the court legally and I will not take any action against him.

[RCBSports]

Cool to see all the replies, but my question really wasn't answered. If I am student athletic trainer, not on the bench (sitting by the admins) and I run out and break up the fight, along with the coaches and admins, would I be at risk for anything that involves the team anything?

[deecee]

Originally Posted by RCBSports

Cool to see all the replies, but my question really wasn't answered. If I am student athletic trainer, not on the bench (sitting by the admins) and I run out and break up the fight, along with the coaches and admins, would I be at risk for anything that involves the team anything?

The question has been answered -- you are not "A COACH"