Whaddya got?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Mark, "meadow muffins" is one of the many tame expletives that Col. Potter used on M*A*S*H. You translated it correctly.


And I would really suggest that you go to one team practice or game and you will see that your statement is utterly and completely false.

Scrapper:

Now that you mention it, I do remember Col. Potter using the term along with "horse hockey."

I really do not care what happens in a team's practice, only what happens during a game. AND during my games the Team Captain is in charge. Case in point:

Daryl Long and I were officiating a boy's 7th/8th grade doubleheader just this past December. Late (less than 60 seconds to play; OhioHSAA uses 6 minute quarters for jr. H.S. games) in the 3rd quarter of the 7th grade game HC-V took exception to my officiating and committed an act of unsportsmanlike conduct and I charged him with the appropriate TF. Daryl came over and informed him that he had lost the use of the Coaching Box for the remainder of the game. HC-V thought Daryl didn't mean it when he told him that he had lost his right to use the CB because he remained standing for the remainder of the 3rd quarter; Daryl even reminded him when he was the T and Team V had the ball in their front court before the end of the 3rd quarter. Less than a minute into the 4th quarter A1 went to the line to shoot 2 FT's and HC-V was still standing. As the T for the upcoming FT's I instructed Captain-V to go over to his coach and instruct him to sit down because he had lost the use of the CB; Captain-V went over to HC-V and told him he had to sit down. HC-V did not sit down. We shot the free throws (which A1 made) and Team V headed up the court with the ball. HC-V remained standing the entire time. At this point the ball went out-of-bounds in front of HC-V and Daryl reminded him that he need to sit down. HC-V wanted to know why. Daryl reminded him that he (Daryl that is) had told him when he (HC-V) received his TF that he had to sit down. HC-V's response was that he doesn't listen to what officials say to him when he is coaching because he has more important things to do. Daryl then reminded him that I (meaning MTD, Sr.) had even sent his Captian to instruct to sit down and he still hadn't sat down. HC-V response to Daryl was: "My captain doesn't tell me what to do." WHACK!! (By Daryl.) HC-V disqualified and ejected (now Daryl has to write a game report).

Long story short (ROFLMAO; me tell a short story) is that HC-V's penalty from the state was an automatic 2 game suspension. Since the team had only one more regular season game to play before their league had its post-season tournament, the school fired HC-V. If only HC-V had listened to his Team Captain, he would still have a coaching job.

MTD, Sr.


P.S. If officials knew and understood precedent and the historical context of the rules, I wouldn't have to write such long dissertions to state the obvious. I really don't think you read any of the rules references I gave nor did you give much weight to how little power that HC has really had per the rules. Re-read my post about the game in the late 1930's and early 1940's, that is the historical context which lays out how the Rules Committee views the Team Captains and the Head Coach. I would suggest that you start using the Team Captains to your advantage. Remind them in the pre-game conference they are in charge of their teams. Remind them that you expect them to break the huddle on the first horn and they are not to wait until their HC decides he is done giving them a 75 second dissertation during a 30 second timeout. You will be suprised how much influence a Team Captain can have over an Head Howler Monkey (oops, I meant a Head Coach).

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

HC-V took exception to my officiating and committed an act of unsportsmanlike conduct and I charged him with the appropriate TF.

And did you give the Captain an indirect technical foul for failing to control his bench? No? Then it's "obvious" that the head coach is in charge of the bench and not the Captain. I can't even believe that you're trying to make such a ridiculous point, Mark. It's not even plausible, let alone true.

More importantly, wtf took you so long to toss the stupid coach? I'm surprised you didn't send him an engraved invitation to use the bench.

[JoeTheRef]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

And did you give the Captain an indirect technical foul for failing to control his bench? No? Then it's "obvious" that the head coach is in charge of the bench and not the Captain. I can't even believe that you're trying to make such a ridiculous point, Mark. It's not even plausible, let alone true.

More importantly, wtf took you so long to toss the stupid coach? I'm surprised you didn't send him an engraved invitation to use the bench.

I've been reading all day and weekend due to the fact that I've been on the court all weekend long and just to tired to post, but Scrap took the words right out of my mouth...what took you and your partner so long to toss the coach? I don't know Daryl Long, but he must be a well respected official for you to call him by name, so seriously, what took you guys so long?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JoeTheRef

I've been reading all day and weekend due to the fact that I've been on the court all weekend long and just to tired to post, but Scrap took the words right out of my mouth...what took you and your partner so long to toss the coach? I don't know Daryl Long, but he must be a well respected official for you to call him by name, so seriously, what took you guys so long?

"Daryl Long" is how MTD refers to his long time regular partner. Presumably because it's his partner's name; but I can't vouch for the veracity of that.

There is a person who posts here by that name, and claims to work with MTD; lending some credence to the theory that MTD is telling the truth.

I was also wondering what took them so long; but it may have just seemed like an eternity because of how long it took to read the story.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by JoeTheRef

I've been reading all day and weekend due to the fact that I've been on the court all weekend long and just to tired to post, but Scrap took the words right out of my mouth...what took you and your partner so long to toss the coach? I don't know Daryl Long, but he must be a well respected official for you to call him by name, so seriously, what took you guys so long?

Daryl H. Long also known on the Board as "The Preacher" is the person in question.

You asked the question: "What took you guys so long?" I presume you wanted to know why it so long for him to get his 2nd TF. My TF was with just under 20 seconds left in the 3rd quarter. Since OhioHSAA sanctioned 7th grade games are played using 6 minute quarters. Daryl's TF came with 5:20 left in the 4th quarter. Team V was getting blown out by Team H. The total amount of playing time between HC-V's first TF and his second TF was less that one minute. Good officials don't give the HC his 2nd TF immediately in this situation. Good officials try to get the HC to willingly comply with the Coaching Box rule. We went the extra mile in this 7th grade game and the HC did not want to meet us half way and he lost his job over it.

MTD, Sr.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

If only HC-V had listened to his Team Captain, he would still have a coaching job.

This doesn't prove the "authority" of the captain, only the idiocy of this coach.

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

P.S. If officials knew and understood precedent and the historical context of the rules, I wouldn't have to write such long dissertions to state the obvious. I really don't think you read any of the rules references I gave nor did you give much weight to how little power that HC has really had per the rules. Re-read my post about the game in the late 1930's and early 1940's, that is the historical context which lays out how the Rules Committee views the Team Captains and the Head Coach. I would suggest that you start using the Team Captains to your advantage. Remind them in the pre-game conference they are in charge of their teams. Remind them that you expect them to break the huddle on the first horn and they are not to wait until their HC decides he is done giving them a 75 second dissertation during a 30 second timeout. You will be suprised how much influence a Team Captain can have over an Head Screaming Monkey (oops, I meant a Head Coach).

Who the heck cares about the late 30's and early 40's? I've never, never seen a captain exercise ANY authority or power over a coach, in any game that I've worked or watched from the stands, or seen on TV. And that's a lot of games. Some captains may have some influence over some coaches, but that's by far the minority of situations. You appear to me to be really out to lunch on this one.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Head Screaming Monkey (oops, I meant a Head Coach).

Mark, please note the correct designation for Head Coach is Howler Monkey, not Screaming Monkey. Please keep your euphemisms straight. Thank you.

BTW - here's a photo of a coach I had this Saturday:

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

Mark, please note the correct designation for Head Coach is Howler Monkey, not Screaming Monkey. Please keep your euphemisms straight. Thank you.

BTW - here's a photo of a coach I had this Saturday:

Mark:

I stand corrected and will edit my post immediately.

MTD, Sr.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Scrapper:



Daryl Long and I were officiating a boy's 7th/8th grade doubleheader just this past December. Late (less than 60 seconds to play; OhioHSAA uses 6 minute quarters for jr. H.S. games) in the 3rd quarter of the 7th grade game HC-V took exception to my officiating and committed an act of unsportsmanlike conduct and I charged him with the appropriate TF. Daryl came over and informed him that he had lost the use of the Coaching Box for the remainder of the game. HC-V thought Daryl didn't mean it when he told him that he had lost his right to use the CB because he remained standing for the remainder of the 3rd quarter; Daryl even reminded him when he was the T and Team V had the ball in their front court before the end of the 3rd quarter. Less than a minute into the 4th quarter A1 went to the line to shoot 2 FT's and HC-V was still standing. As the T for the upcoming FT's I instructed Captain-V to go over to his coach and instruct him to sit down because he had lost the use of the CB; Captain-V went over to HC-V and told him he had to sit down. HC-V did not sit down. We shot the free throws (which A1 made) and Team V headed up the court with the ball. HC-V remained standing the entire time. At this point the ball went out-of-bounds in front of HC-V and Daryl reminded him that he need to sit down. HC-V wanted to know why. Daryl reminded him that he (Daryl that is) had told him when he (HC-V) received his TF that he had to sit down. HC-V's response was that he doesn't listen to what officials say to him when he is coaching because he has more important things to do. Daryl then reminded him that I (meaning MTD, Sr.) had even sent his Captian to instruct to sit down and he still hadn't sat down. HC-V response to Daryl was: "My captain doesn't tell me what to do." WHACK!! (By Daryl.) HC-V disqualified and ejected (now Daryl has to write a game report).

Are you putting us on? You notified/warned/reminded him 5
times that he had lost the box, and then kicked him out for saying "My captain doesn't tell me what to do." This sounds like the most reasonable statement of the whole exchange to me.