Can't we all just get along?

just another ref · #1 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 09:03am

Apparently the search function only goes back one year? I have posted a couple of threads about a jr. high principal and some, uh, incidents. One shows up, one doesn't. some things are more important than money

I went to call games Monday and there he was. Oh, well, hope for the best, expect the worst, and deal with whatever happens. Time to begin, and my partner walks up to the table and picks up the ball. The principal steps down out of the stands. He tells my partner "You need to be the referee for both games." He points at me. "That guy cheats against us. Three times he has thrown games." Partner looked at him like you might look at something a dog left on the sidewalk, shrugged, shook his head, and tossed the ball to me at the circle. Principal continued his rant. "He is the only dishonest official I know. If it happens tonight, I'm calling the commissioner's office this time."
(I'd love to hear that conversation.) Partner stood there with his back to the guy and did not acknowledge him any more. In the girls game there was a player control foul on the point guard for my friend's team where she planted her defender with a forearm. I was a little shaky on the call, thought the defender might have bumped her first, but I made it. Principal chimed in loudly, "That's one you got right! That's the first one you got right!" Take a compliment any way you can get it. Between games the principal approached my partner again and spoke briefly. I said now what? Partner said he had merely said that we called a good game. Go figure.

I frequently latch on to mick's theme: Get in. Get done. Get out.

Scrapper1 · #2 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 09:14am

Why did you and your partner allow him to stay at the game?

Scrapper1 · #3 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 09:44am

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref

Apparently the search function only goes back one year? I have posted a couple of threads about a jr. high principal and some, uh, incidents. One shows up, one doesn't.

Was it one of these?

Continued fallout from a past incident
all part of my job?

Mark Padgett · #4 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 10:11am

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref

He tells my partner "You need to be the referee for both games." He points at me. "That guy cheats against us. Three times he has thrown games." Partner looked at him like you might look at something a dog left on the sidewalk, shrugged, shook his head, and tossed the ball to me at the circle. Principal continued his rant. "He is the only dishonest official I know. If it happens tonight, I'm calling the commissioner's office this time."

IANAL, but it seems to me that if he accuses you of being dishonest and his accusation results in you losing work, you have a case for slander. I would have told him that to his face.

And - I agree with Scrapper - that guy would have been long gone if it was my game.

BktBallRef · #5 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 10:25am

"Sir. I don't know what issues you have with my partner but now is neither the time nor place. You're the leader of this school and should be setting an example. You're either going to have to calm down and address this later or leave. The choice is yours."

#6 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 10:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

"Sir. I don't know what issues you have with my partner but now is neither the time nor place. You're the leader of this school and should be setting an example. You're either going to have to calm down and address this later or leave. The choice is yours."

And maybe remind him, since there's no administrator around after we toss him, we could forfeit the game.

Adam · #7 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 11:02am

If he managed to stay in after the initial tirade, the little display of mockery would have ended his time in the gym.

just another ref · #8 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 01:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Was it one of these?

Continued fallout from a past incident
all part of my job?

That's them. How do you do that?

just another ref · #9 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 01:40pm

Everybody I have talked to about this matter all seem to kind of treat this guy like a crazy relative.

"We know he ain't right. We know none of this is your fault. But just ignore him and work around him as best you can."

I just feel like if I tried to have him ejected from the gym for anything short of coming onto the court screaming during the game, it would make more trouble for me.

Some of the principals around here have taken the path of least resistance on this matter. "We need the game worse than we need you as an official and possibly no game or an incident at the game. Nothing personal, but we'll have somebody else here for this one." Hard to blame them here. But it is still difficult to let a guy like this dictate anything to anyone, especially something that it is in no way his place to do so.

True colors do have a way of coming out. Last year, before the tournament at the school where the game was this week, the coach called mr. principal to discuss, "Look, chief, I don't know if j. a. r. will be here or not, but if he is, he will be calling games, so just let me know if y'all are not coming." Mr. principal told him no problem, it was all in the past. I called at the tournament, including some of their games, without incident. The following Monday, another local jr. high was at mr. principal's place, and he said, "Oh, by the way, if (you know who) is officiating your tournament next week, we are not coming."

just another ref · #10 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 01:43pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

And maybe remind him, since there's no administrator around after we toss him, we could forfeit the game.

Perhaps I did not make it clear, the guy we are discussing is the visiting
principal in everything that has happened.

Scrapper1 · #11 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 02:24pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref

That's them. How do you do that?

I went to the "Advanced Search" and searched for the keywords "principal confrontation" and limited the search to the basketball forum. That came up empty, so I tried "principal complain" and looked for a thread that you started. One came up and in that thread, you had posted the link to the other thread.

WhistlesAndStripes · #12 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 03:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref

Perhaps I did not make it clear, the guy we are discussing is the visiting
principal in everything that has happened.

All the more reason to just get rid of him then.

I personally would have run him as soon as he said something DURING the game.

Mark Padgett · #13 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 04:40pm

This seems like one of those times you would ask your association to boycott the clown.

SMEngmann · #14 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 04:50pm

Your partner should've addressed the situation somehow, and you should have made it clear to your partner during the pregame what the past history was to anticipate the problem and discuss possible solutions. In my game, I probably would have run the guy or had game management ready to get him outta there to avoid direct confrontation.

My question to you JAR, is why do you keep taking games involving this team? With all these posts it seems like a personal feud. I understand the thought process of not wanting an idiot to win in a situation like this, but what do you gain by continuing to work this guy's games? You will never gain this guy's respect or acknowledgement even by calling perfect games every time, nor should you care about it. You will also not change this guy's behavior, nor is it your job or your responsibility. Life's too short and there are plenty of other schools that would love for you to work their games, so I suggest that you just stay away from this school and avoid the headaches.

If you are still adament about working these games, I suggest having someone videotape the game to capture his behavior, and to demonstrate that you called a solid game.

just another ref · #15 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 17, 2007, 06:30pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMEngmann

Your partner should've addressed the situation somehow, and you should have made it clear to your partner during the pregame what the past history was to anticipate the problem and discuss possible solutions. In my game, I probably would have run the guy or had game management ready to get him outta there to avoid direct confrontation.

He knew the situation, just did not know all the details. I filled him in at halftime. I actually liked the way he handled the situation. He might as well have put a rubber stamp on the guy's forehead which said: THIS PERSON NOT WORTHY OF OUR ATTENTION

Quote:

My question to you JAR, is why do you keep taking games involving this team? With all these posts it seems like a personal feud. I understand the thought process of not wanting an idiot to win in a situation like this, but what do you gain by continuing to work this guy's games?

It is mainly the principle of the thing not the money. But money is also a factor when I missed several entire tournaments within a few miles of my home just because of something that never really happened in the first place.