New Rule

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Hartsy

The timer should be watching the official for the "chop", not watching to see when the ball is touched. Are we supposed to start the clock on the kick, whistle it dead, and give the stop clock signal all at the same time?

Surely this has been dealt with in a case play somewhere.

It's dealt with under NFHS rule 5-9-4 very explicitly. You start the clock on the "touch". If you then deem that "touch" a violation, you stop the clock. That's rule 5-8-1(c).

It's not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing with any concept. You work with what you have. What we currently have is those two rules along with the explicit language contained in those rules.

Again, if you do change the rule so that it reads a "legal" touch, how does the timer now know whether that touch is legal or not, and when to start the clock? Whether the touch was "legal" or not can only be decided by the official, not the timer. If the timer waits to see that the official did NOT blow the whistle for a kicking violation, then the timer is going to be late starting the clock.

[Hartsy]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

It's dealt with under NFHS rule 5-9-4 very explicitly. You start the clock on the "touch". If you then deem that "touch" a violation, you stop the clock. That's rule 5-8-1(c).

It's not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing with any concept. You work with what you have. What we currently have is those two rules along with the explicit language contained in those rules.

Again, if you do change the rule so that it reads a "legal" touch, how does the timer now know whether that touch is legal or not, and when to start the clock? Whether the touch was "legal" or not can only be decided by the official, not the timer. If the timer waits to see that the official did NOT blow the whistle for a kicking violation, then the timer is going to be late starting the clock.

OK. If I agree that starting the clock on ANY touch is the rule, and the rule is apparently stated that way, then we start the clock on the touch/kick with a "chop" signal, then blow the whistle and raise an open hand to stop the clock. I'd rather the rule be written to just keep the open hand raised and blow the whistle on the kick, thus no time elapsed.

And I'll say again, the timer should be watching the officials signal and not the ball for when to start the clock. I will even remind them of this in cases like this one. Ever see a clock start early because the timer thought the ball was tipped on throw in? or on down court throw in with the ball tipped at the line, but the clock didn't start until the home team caught the pass and hit an apparent game winner?

[Old School]

Here's the deal. The people you are debating this rule with, believes there is nothing wrong with this new rule, everything is okay. Simple. Now you know why the rulesets are so different between college, hs and pros. There are too many one track minded people in this industry and they don't think out the right side of their brain. There's also something in the water. This is by far one of the dumbest rules federation as come out with. Everyone on this committe needs to be fired for this one. They should all resign immediately because it's clear they are not helping and i don't think they understand the game which is another clear indication they shouldn't be there.

One more thing, you know how we get in trouble when we make bad calls in a game. Well, the committee members should take a hit for this one. We don't want this group of people making no more changes to the NFHS rule sets. No more. A slight modification was all that was needed, instead they went stupid, which kind of tells you a lot about the officials that support this new rule.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Old School

Here's the deal. The people you are debating this rule with, believes there is nothing wrong with this new rule, everything is okay. Simple. Now you know why the rulesets are so different between college, hs and pros. There are too many one track minded people in this industry and they don't think out the right side of their brain. There's also something in the water. This is by far one of the dumbest rules federation as come out with. Everyone on this committe needs to be fired for this one. They should all resign immediately because it's clear they are not helping and i don't hink they understand the game which is another clear indication they shouldn't be there.

One more thing, you know how we get in trouble when we make bad calls in a game. Well, the committee members should take a hit for this one. We don't want this group of people making no more changes to the NFHS rule sets. No more. A slight modification was all that was needed, instead they went stupid, which kind of tells you a lot about the officials that support this new rule.

WTF?!?!?

(Used with permission.)

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

WTF?!?!?

Logical and reasonable discussion just ended on this thread. That's "WTF"!

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Logical and reasonable discussion just ended on this thread. That's "WTF"!

I'm closing my eyes, clicking my heels, and saying to myself, "There's no place like home...", and maybe things will get back to normal?

So, anyway, do you think making the timing correction is reasonable? I understand your point about the timer needs to do what they need to do, but wouldn't we have the ability now to correct it?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

I'm closing my eyes, clicking my heels, and saying to myself, "There's no place like home...", and maybe things will get back to normal?

So, anyway, do you think making the timing correction is reasonable? I understand your point about the timer needs to do what they need to do, but wouldn't we have the ability now to correct it?

I don't think so. JR convinced me. I'm not correcting this either way. The only time you can put back on is what came off after your whistle blew.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

So, anyway, do you think making the timing correction is reasonable? I understand your point about the timer needs to do what they need to do, but wouldn't we have the ability now to correct it?

The concept might be reasonable but we'd need a rule change or case play to do something like that. Right now, we can only make time timing corrections when the timer makes a mistake. In this particular situation, the timer did not make a mistake; he followed the rules.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Old School

A slight modification was all that was needed, instead they went stupid, which kind of tells you a lot about the officials that support this new rule.

Actually, this post tells us far more about you than it does about any other official.

Content of character, indeed.