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-   -   In case you haven't hear...Joey Crawford (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/33737-case-you-havent-hear-joey-crawford.html)

Dan_ref Mon Apr 23, 2007 04:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Ha!

Beat 'ya! :p
Shut up.

Oh wait we did that one already...

Camron Rust Mon Apr 23, 2007 04:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge
There are 19 and 20 year olds running divisions in the military during a war. I guess war is not as hard as blowing the whistle in a game. :rolleyes:

Peace
While I agree with you in principle, this is NOT true. I doubt there are ANY 19/20 year olds running divisions in any military branch since divisions have thousands of soliders and are headed by very senior officiers (generals)...and there are NO 19/20 year old officiers, much less generals.

BBall_Junkie Mon Apr 23, 2007 04:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockyroad
Once again I have to go find a rag to wipe the coffee off my monitor...haven't had to do that since the other day when I saw that the BoSux had rallied against Rivera to win the game!!
I had to wipe of my TV Screen when I saw that the BoSux went back- to back- to back- to back (does that equal 4 in a row? I've lost track)homeruns of the Yanks. Sheesh, was Wright underhanding the ball to the plate or what?

M&M Guy Mon Apr 23, 2007 04:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBall_Junkie
I had to wipe of my TV Screen when I saw that the BoSux went back- to back- to back- to back (does that equal 4 in a row? I've lost track)homeruns of the Yanks. Sheesh, was Wright underhanding the ball to the plate or what?
Attention, mods - off-topic alert!

<font size = -3>(Oops, never mind)</font size>

Anyway, none of the 4 were Big Papi; who woulda thunk it.

Jurassic Referee Mon Apr 23, 2007 05:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBall_Junkie
I had to wipe of my TV Screen when I saw that the BoSux went back- to back- to back- to back (does that equal 4 in a row? I've lost track)homeruns of the Yanks. Sheesh, was Wright underhanding the ball to the plate or what?
Hahahaha.......

Maybe one day they'll get a major league baseball franchise in Texas and you'll have your own team to cheer for.

How 'bout them Spurs/Mavericks?:D

Adam Mon Apr 23, 2007 07:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust
While I agree with you in principle, this is NOT true. I doubt there are ANY 19/20 year olds running divisions in any military branch since divisions have thousands of soliders and are headed by very senior officiers (generals)...and there are NO 19/20 year old officiers, much less generals.
Maybe not complete divisions, but in a war, it's not unheard of for an E-4 or E-5 to be thrust into a leadership position due to "attrition."

Also, given that we're putting very effective and deadly ammunition in the hands of 18, 19, and 20 year olds and that the decisions they make with these weapons could potentially have global ramifications; Jeff's point remains valid.

It was the first thing I thought of when the airline pilot reference was made. The ramifications of an airline pilot making a mistake are much larger than a missed call on a basketball court.

BillyMac Mon Apr 23, 2007 07:31pm
Older Pilots ??
 
ORLANDO, Fla., April 9, 2007: AirTran Airways, a subsidiary of AirTran Holdings, Inc., today announced that it supports the FAA's plan to change the mandatory retirement age of commercial airline pilots from 60 to 65. The FAA said that it intends to make the change within the next two years.
AirTran Airways' support mirrors the support for the change by its 1,400 member pilot union, the National Pilots Association (NPA). Recently, the NPA's Board of Directors voted unanimously to endorse changing the law to allow U.S. pilots the opportunity to fly an additional five years.
"AirTran Airways understands that raising the mandatory retirement age for pilots is a positive decision that makes sense for the industry," said Bob Fornaro, president and chief operating officer of AirTran Airways. "Our airline employs well-trained and seasoned professional pilots, and we believe in the great benefits that years of hands-on experience can bring to the job at AirTran Airways."

"The NPA Board of Directors also supports raising the retirement age for pilots to 65, and we are excited that AirTran Airways agrees with the decision," said Capt. Allen Philpot, president of the National Pilots Association. "Provisions need to be put in place now to keep those pilots who satisfy FAA medical standards on the job beyond age 60. It is crucial to keep our most experienced pilots in place just like our international counterparts."

JRutledge Mon Apr 23, 2007 08:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust
While I agree with you in principle, this is NOT true. I doubt there are ANY 19/20 year olds running divisions in any military branch since divisions have thousands of soliders and are headed by very senior officiers (generals)...and there are NO 19/20 year old officiers, much less generals.
If you use just a little common sense, you would realize was speaking in general terms. I was not suggesting that any 19 or 20 year old were running an "actual" military division to the point they were a General or other rank where they answered to the President.

I am sure in some cases there are 21 year olds that are officers after graduating from a military institution or ROTC program that make some pretty heavy decisions that could affect lives. If a person of that age can handle that kind of decision making, I am sure a 21 year old can handle a varsity game, which in many cases is not that big of a deal. All varsity games are not created equally.

Peace

Camron Rust Mon Apr 23, 2007 09:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge
If you use just a little common sense, you would realize was speaking in general terms. I was not suggesting that any 19 or 20 year old were running an "actual" military division to the point they were a General or other rank where they answered to the President.

I am sure in some cases there are 21 year olds that are officers after graduating from a military institution or ROTC program that make some pretty heavy decisions that could affect lives. If a person of that age can handle that kind of decision making, I am sure a 21 year old can handle a varsity game, which in many cases is not that big of a deal. All varsity games are not created equally.

Peace
Remember, I agreed with you in principle. If you wouldn't have so dramatically and inaccurately overstated the point, it wouldn't have merited my original reply. How is one to know if you were talking about an "actual" division or a "figurative" division when the context was suggesting the former. 19 and 20 year olds are no where close to even having a conversation with the ones running divisions (groups with 10-15,000 people). They are more likely running platoons or squads (usualy a couple dozen people at most....and mostly 18 year-olds).

JRutledge Mon Apr 23, 2007 09:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust
Remember, I agreed with you in principle. If you wouldn't have so dramatically and inaccurately overstated the point, it wouldn't have merited my original reply. How is one to know if you were talking about an "actual" division or a "figurative" division when the context was suggesting the former. 19 and 20 year olds are no where close to even having a conversation with the ones running divisions (groups with 10-15,000 people). They more likely running platoons or squads (usualy a couple dozen people at most....and mostly 18 year-olds).
Whether you agreed with me is not the issue.

The point was that 19 and 20 year olds are capable to handle very serious situations that involve life and death every single day. Calling a varsity game is not life or death. I am not a military expert nor do I have a personal experience in the military as it relates to the overall structure. And considering the multiple people here that are currently in the military did not even address what an "actual division" consisted of, says a lot about the point I was trying to make.

I think officiating is very hard to do very well, but it ain't life or death. Now are you going to evaluate my usage of the word "ain't?”

Peace

Nevadaref Tue Apr 24, 2007 01:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac
ORLANDO, Fla., April 9, 2007: AirTran Airways, a subsidiary of AirTran Holdings, Inc., today announced that it supports the FAA's plan to change the mandatory retirement age of commercial airline pilots from 60 to 65. The FAA said that it intends to make the change within the next two years.
AirTran Airways' support mirrors the support for the change by its 1,400 member pilot union, the National Pilots Association (NPA). Recently, the NPA's Board of Directors voted unanimously to endorse changing the law to allow U.S. pilots the opportunity to fly an additional five years.
"AirTran Airways understands that raising the mandatory retirement age for pilots is a positive decision that makes sense for the industry," said Bob Fornaro, president and chief operating officer of AirTran Airways. "Our airline employs well-trained and seasoned professional pilots, and we believe in the great benefits that years of hands-on experience can bring to the job at AirTran Airways."

"The NPA Board of Directors also supports raising the retirement age for pilots to 65, and we are excited that AirTran Airways agrees with the decision," said Capt. Allen Philpot, president of the National Pilots Association. "Provisions need to be put in place now to keep those pilots who satisfy FAA medical standards on the job beyond age 60. It is crucial to keep our most experienced pilots in place just like our international counterparts."
Thank you, sir! So the current FAA age limit for pilots is 60, which just so happens to be what I recommended for HS basketball officials.

BTW on the lower end of age limits, our federal government has these:
House of Representatives = 25
Senate = 30
President = 35

Now why is that? What about that 34 year-old who could do a better job than anyone else as President, but is prevented from serving? Isn't that unfair? :eek:

Nevadaref Tue Apr 24, 2007 02:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
Yeah, you stated what FIFA does. What you didn't state was the size of the soccer playing area versus the size of a basketball court, or the number of players either.
- an international soccer field is a minimum of 110 yards by 70 yards. The maximum size is 120 yards by 80 yards. Iow, the field must lie between 69,300 square feet and 86,600 square feet.
- A high school court is 84 feet by 50 feet and a college court is 94 feet by 50 feet. Iow, the court must lie between 4200 square feet and 4700 square feet.
- Comparing maximum dimensions, a soccer field is over EIGHTEEN(18) times bigger than a college basketball court.
- Comparing minimum dimensions a soccer field is over SIXTEEN(16) bigger than a high school court.
- Soccer uses one on-field official.
-Basketball uses a minimum of two officials and an </B>optimum</B> of three officials.
- One on-field soccer official is asked to keep his eye on a total of 22 players.
- Two or three basketball officials are asked to keep an eye on a total of 10 players.

Sooooo, to properly evaluate your great idea, we would have to put basketball standards at each end of a soccer field, increase the number of players per team from 5 to 11, and have ONE official try to officiate that game. Of course, you would also give him a person on each sideline to call the out-of-bounds. Under those conditions, I'll kinda agree with you that your poor l'il lonesome official out there better damnwell be in great physical condition, and age restrictions might make sense. It's the same as trying to do a college or pro football game with one official. Of course, what makes more sense would be to put more officials out on the field for better play coverage and thus cut down the physical requirements needed of an official. Obviously, FIFA...and you.....haven't been able to come up with anything quite so.....logical.....as that.

You're comparing apples to elephants.

Your whacko idea might be worthy of discussion but it sureasheck is bereft of even a shred of merit.
So, JR, are you now saying that size matters! :D

Too bad that you are completely ignorant of the officiating system of soccer. It really makes all that abacus work worth absolutely nothing.

Soccer uses THREE referees, one center and two assistants, plus a 4th official on high level matches to watch the players. All of them are empowered to call fouls. The two assistants do much more than just call the ball out-of-bounds as you so sadly believe. The most recent World Cup Final proves this as, according to the official FIFA match report, it was the 4th official who observed Zidane's headbutt, told the nearest AR, and he then informed the center referee, who displayed the red card.

FYI the 4th official is soccer's most recent attempt to put more eyes on the field to observe the 22 players. FIFA has even experimented with two Center Referees, such as the NHL has implemented.

JRutledge Tue Apr 24, 2007 02:40am
Who cares about soccer? Go to the soccer board and discuss that mess. And you knew what JR meant when he discussed on “on field referee.”

This discussion is about basketball, not soccer. I have a hard time respecting a sport and its officials when they allow a player to act like they are dying after getting a little contact, then once they are taken off on a stretcher to run right back onto the field as if nothing happens. So if FIBA wants a limit on age of when they officials work so be it. The Bottom line you came up with a lame comment and have been trying to figure out a way to have it make since. Soccer is a different sport and has a different objective. I guess you probably think that football officials should just retire as well because most of those officials at top levels are in their 50s.

Peace

Nevadaref Tue Apr 24, 2007 03:43am
Who cares about football? Go to the football board and discuss that mess. :p

It is officiated by a bunch of fat, old guys who can't run anyway. That is why they need six or seven of them out there.

Jurassic Referee Tue Apr 24, 2007 06:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref
So, JR, are you now saying that size matters!

Too bad that you are completely ignorant of the officiating system of soccer. It really makes all that abacus work worth absolutely nothing.

Soccer uses THREE referees, one center and two assistants, plus a 4th official on high level matches to watch the players. All of them are empowered to call fouls. The two assistants do much more than just call the ball out-of-bounds as you so sadly believe. The most recent World Cup Final proves this as, according to the official FIFA match report, it was the 4th official who observed Zidane's headbutt, told the nearest AR, and he then informed the center referee, who displayed the red card.
Yes, as it relates to the size of the playing surface, I sureasheck am saying that size matters.

The two assistants in soccer are required to be on each sideline, <b>not</b> on the field. If either of them is required to make a call on something that occurs in the center of the field, that means that they must make their call from a minimum of <b>40 yards</b> or <b>120 feet</b> away. And if the play occurred 20 yards behind where the side official is located, you can add even more distance on.The basketball equivalent(high school length) would be to line up two basketball courts end-to-end, put an official at the end of the first court, and then ask them to call something that happens around center, or farther, on the <b>next</b> court. And at the same time add another 12 players on the courts to help block your view. Yup, that's great coverage that you're advocating, Nevada. Hell, we worry about the C in a 3-man crew calling <b>across court</b>, and you think that it's OK to call something that might happen a court and a half away.

I'll stick to my feelings about soccer coverage. You can't equate the officiating of that game as to how a basketball game is expected to be officiated. Or a football game, for that matter. I'll also sureashell stick to my opinion of your proposed age restrictions for basketball officials. They are strictly without merit, as in completely stoopid.


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