I probably should have

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by NewNCref

2.) Pardon my french, but who gives a damn what the fans think? If I cared what the fans thought about the game, I would have never considered picking up a whistle. If he says something that's T-worthy, then YOU didn't put them on the line, HE did. I don't care what some stupid fanboys think after the game. My job is the enforce the rules as written, not to make sure the game ends to the satisfaction of the fanboys.

That just about about brought a tear to my eye. Just about.

I completely agree with that logic.

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by jsblanton

. . . and he told me "It's obvious what is going on here".

Good, coach. I'm glad at least one of us knows!

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by jsblanton

I am new to this forum and new to basketball officiating. Not that these are good excusses but it's better than none. I was doing a game between two very good JV teams. One point game with a 5.4 seconds left. Team that is behind steals ball on the baseline and then clearly steps out of bounds. I am the lead and I am right on top of it. I make the call, point in the correct direction and the coach of the team that is behind (also visiting) calls time-out and while going to the huddle he asks me if I am sure. I said yes, absolutley, and he told me "It's obvious what is going on here". After the game was over I thought about it and I think I should have given him a T for questioning my integrity. Just thought I would see what some of you thought.

Good no bang! That statement could be taking in a good or bad way. If you bang he can reverse his statement on you saying i didnt mean it that way. I meant you were being fair. Dont assume! If you bang you have interrupted the game and your great game has been dismantled. Think preventive officiating.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by TRef21

Good no bang! That statement could be taking in a good or bad way. If you bang he can reverse his statement on you saying i didnt mean it that way. I meant you were being fair. Dont assume! If you bang you have interrupted the game and your great game has been dismantled. Think preventive officiating.

eesh.

1. Any coach who makes this comment and then claims it was meant as a compliment is a liar of Imus proportions. Which is why I make them repeat it in an clear, uncertain manner so they cannot deny it later.

2. Game interruption and preventative officiating is camp-speak for don't cause trouble. If your life strategy is to not cause trouble then get out of officiating.

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

eesh.

1. Any coach who makes this comment and then claims it was meant as a compliment is a liar of Imus proportions. Which is why I make them repeat it in an clear, uncertain manner so they cannot deny it later.

2. Game interruption and preventative officiating is camp-speak for don't cause trouble. If your life strategy is to not cause trouble then get out of officiating.

OUCH! But point well taken. Yah we all no that remark by the coach is regarding towards us, but I'm saying, it would take a lot more to tech than something little like that. There is book officiating and there is common sense officiating. Yes by the book its a tech, but have 5.4 which is ample time to get the ball back and heavy prayer if that can be the case. Just my philosophy though. Working h.s. and college I incorporate different things into my game. If coach told me that, I wouldn't tech him. Some would. we are all different.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TRef21

There is book officiating and there is common sense officiating.

Why do people try to use something like "by the book officiating" as an excuse to not call a "T"? And why do people try to say that you need to use "common sense officiating" to back up what is only their opinion of what common sense actually is? If a coach calls you an azzhole with 5.4 seconds to go, are you going to ignore that also because if you call it, it's "book officiating" and not "common sense officiating"?

I guess that my idea of "common sense officiating" is completely different than yours. Common sense officiating to me means that you simply take care of bidness when you have to, without making up phony excuses why you shouldn't penalize unsporting conduct. Common sense officiating also means to me that you clean up the unsporting crap so that the next set of officials might not have to deal with it either.

We'll just have to disagree on the meaning of "common sense", I guess.

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Why do people try to use something like "by the book officiating" as an excuse to not call a "T"? And why do people try to say that you need to use "common sense officiating" to back up what is only their opinion of what common sense actually is? If a coach calls you an azzhole with 5.4 seconds to go, are you going to ignore that also because if you call it, it's "book officiating" and not "common sense officiating"?

I guess that my idea of "common sense officiating" is completely different than yours. Common sense officiating to me means that you simply take care of bidness when you have to, without making up phony excuses why you shouldn't penalize unsporting conduct. Common sense officiating also means to me that you clean up the unsporting crap so that the next set of officials might not have to deal with it either.

We'll just have to disagree on the meaning of "common sense", I guess.

I understand what you are saying, but in this case the coach didnt call you a vulgar name. If he does then by all means stick him or even run him depending on the vulgarity. That happened to me in a college game this past season. Coach said F YOU I stick him. 2 mins left he made a 15 pt comeback and lost. we had interrupted dribble and he was yelling for time out. I dont grant steal and layup. Grant the time out he comes up to the table yelling at me I wanted time, I said let me tell you why I cant grant it, he was like dont talk to me and walking back he says F YOU. I wack him. No brainer. In the scenario we are talking about would you really stick a coach for that comment?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by TRef21

OUCH! But point well taken. Yah we all no that remark by the coach is regarding towards us, but I'm saying, it would take a lot more to tech than something little like that. There is book officiating and there is common sense officiating. Yes by the book its a tech, but have 5.4 which is ample time to get the ball back and heavy prayer if that can be the case. Just my philosophy though. Working h.s. and college I incorporate different things into my game. If coach told me that, I wouldn't tech him. Some would. we are all different.

No one cares what levels you work.

That said, the OP is not a HS or college official he's a new guy, so camp-speak like game interrupters is lost on him at best. At worst it's going to confuse him and make him think it's OK to take all sorts of sh1t from coaches in the name of your holy game management.

Sometimes game management means having the balls to take care of business.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TRef21

In the scenario we are talking about would you really stick a coach for that comment?

If he owned up to it, yes I sureasheck would. If he was smart enough to keep his mouth shut when asked about it, no.

I don't believe in ignoring unsporting behavior just because there's only a few seconds left in a game. I don't believe in ignoring it at any time. And I also agree with Dan_ref that your "game interrupter" and "preventive officiating" comments are basically nothing but excuses not to call a technical foul. If you're not preventing somebody from committing an unsporting act, I can't see how anyone could ever call that "preventive officiating".

[jsblanton]

I should clarify. I am new to basketball officiating but I have Umpired baseball for 11 years. I asked my partner what he would have done after the game was over. He said, given the situation, I probably made the right decision. The coach was OK for the whole game until that one moment. My only problem with not asking him to clarify was, Does he really think I am home cooking him? or is it just a heat of the moment comment. Either way his team lost and he didn't have a TECH (or me) at the end of the game to blame for the loss. I guess it's one of those things to remember and hope if it ever happens again I will use good judgment and not fly off of the handle. But it sure is funny how certain calls we make (or don't) seem to stick with us.

[Mark Dexter]

Originally Posted by TRef21

In the scenario we are talking about would you really stick a coach for that comment?

Absolutely.

He gave himself the rope and tied the knot. By asking the follow-up, you're letting him bring himself down from the gallows. If not - ring him up.

[TRef21]

I would like to appologize to the room. I did not know OP was a new official. I very sorry for any confusion. I'm sorry if I pissed any of you off as well. I'm just saying what I would do in the situation. OP is technically correct, that he should've given a Technical Foul. I'm sorry for any confusion OP, Sorry for getting any of you upset as well.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TRef21

I would like to apologize to the room. I did not know OP was a new official. I very sorry for any confusion. I'm sorry if I pissed any of you off as well. I'm just saying what I would do in the situation. OP is technically correct, that he should've given a Technical Foul. I'm sorry for any confusion OP, Sorry for getting any of you upset as well.

Whoa there. No need to apologize to anybody at all. You gave your opinion. We disagreed with your opinion and told you why we disagreed. That's all. No biggie.

Btw though, it might not be a bad idea to forget about constantly mentioning the fact that you do some college ball. There's a whole bunch of officials here that have worked higher levels of college than you and for a much longer time also. In some areas, it's a lot easier to break into JUCO and D3 games than it is is to get a good high school varsity schedule. The fact that some people do college games at whatever level doesn't really give their answers any more credibility than the rawest rookie posting here. We're all wrong occasionally, no matter what, and we're all here to learn.

That's my opinion anyway fwiw.

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Whoa there. No need to apologize to anybody at all. You gave your opinion. We disagreed with your opinion and told you why we disagreed. That's all. No biggie.

Btw though, it might not be a bad idea to forget about constantly mentioning the fact that you do some college ball. There's a whole bunch of officials here that have worked higher levels of college than you and for a much longer time also. In some areas, it's a lot easier to break into JUCO and D3 games than it is is to get a good high school varsity schedule. The fact that some people do college games at whatever level doesn't really give their answers any more credibility than the rawest rookie posting here. We're all wrong occasionally, no matter what, and we're all here to learn.

That's my opinion anyway fwiw.

Thanks man. It's just that I hear from camp and my fellow officials at all levels. I have incorporated and modified it to my game and want to pass it down no matter what level it is. I'm trying not to sound big time or anything like that. I don't want you guys to think I have stick up my A$$ or anything.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by TRef21

Thanks man. It's just that I hear from camp and my fellow officials at all levels. I have incorporated and modified it to my game and want to pass it down no matter what level it is. I'm trying not to sound big time or anything like that. I don't want you guys to think I have stick up my A$$ or anything.

I will have to disagree with some here. I have no problem with you talking about the level you work. It gives me and many others perspective about where you are coming from. Also those that say you should not talk about the levels you work they will be the first to ridicule those that do not work at a certain level. A few people cannot speak for all of us. Unfortunately we cannot see everyone work on the court so all you have is what you talk about here. It is other people's problem if they cannot deal with what you do.

Peace