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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Fri Nov 09, 2001, 10:38pm
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I don’t often have a need to vent, but this was just one of those nights. I help with a youth league run by Florida Basketball and Volleyball Assoc. (FBVA). Tonight I had three games and they were all three, shall we say, memorable.

First game was 7-8 yr olds. BTW, I have found this to be the hardest age group to officiate. The league has a rule that this age group cannot press in the backcourt. After the first warning, Team “B” got a “T” for pressing and the coach went ballistic. The coach for “B” was very vocal right from the start, which doesn’t bother me as long as it doesn’t get personal. But as coaches will, he stepped over the line with his comments. “T” for coach (that’s 2 now for those of you that are counting). Then he drops the “F”_bomb on me. That’s it he’s gone. So while we are shooting the 6 throws several of the moms in the bleachers ask in a not-so-nice way why I tossed the coach. I said I didn’t think anyone would appreciate him using that kind of language in front of their kids, so he got ran. And this was the good game.

The second game was 12-13 yr olds. My partner and I had a run in with a couple of obnoxious parents after the game. At one point I had to physically get in between Mr. Johnny’s dad and my partner.

I would be interested to hear how you deal with fans like this. I know we could suspend the game and have them removed, but this was after the game.

The third game was 14-15 yr olds. The score was 85 to 15. Enough said.



[Edited by Mike Burns on Nov 13th, 2001 at 02:02 PM]
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sat Nov 10, 2001, 12:47am
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Unhappy

Sad the adults aren't acting their ages, isn't it?
I hear this all the time from officials in many sports that the "younger" age groups (non-high school stuff) can be the most be the work and abuse. Only topped by men's leagues, right gang?
I don't know who runs the program you officiated, but they should be aware of what happened and act upon it. To steal a pharse from a local soccer league, we need to have ZERO tolerance with this poor behavior. T 'em up earlier, sit 'em down or toss 'em. NO room for knuckleheads around the kids.
I run the local basketball league in our town. Before I took it over, we had several loud and obnoxious coaches & fans. They didn't use board officials, just volunteers.
The first thing I did was tell the league I'd run it, if I could hire board officials. Second, all the coaches prior to the beginning of the season, were handed out my list of "misunderstood" basketball rules, which we went over in detail. This "educated" them on the rules and cleared up the myths they had about the rules. I have also handed them out to the parents in the past to keep the fans in line. This has worked great for me. I hardly have any problems with coaches or fans now. I f anyone gets out of line, I will talk with them, reminding them they paid for their child to play, not to come and yell at the ref's or players.
Good luck
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sat Nov 10, 2001, 01:37pm
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MISUNDERSTOOD RULES

Art N: I have some friend/parents who need the use of your misunderstood rules sheet. Could you post them or e-mail them to me? That tact was a GREAT way to defuse potential problems in your league. Thanks!
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sat Nov 10, 2001, 02:13pm
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That list of misunderstood rules sounds interesting. I'd also like a copy if possible. Actually, it would make for an interesting post here. We could possible add some of our own to the list.

Ren
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Old Sat Nov 10, 2001, 02:18pm
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Thumbs up

I agree. It sounds like it would be a good thread.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sat Nov 10, 2001, 05:36pm
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LOL LOL in a high school VARSITY game I had a mom yell at me about 3 seconds against the team on DEFENSE!! Now I have not called 3 seconds in a varsity game in about 5 years and I was not going to start with the defense lol.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old Sat Nov 10, 2001, 08:09pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by ballsandstrikes
LOL LOL in a high school VARSITY game I had a mom yell at me about 3 seconds against the team on DEFENSE!! Now I have not called 3 seconds in a varsity game in about 5 years and I was not going to start with the defense lol.
Must be an NBA fan!
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Old Sun Nov 11, 2001, 11:06am
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Two rules you should always follow:

1. In these rec league games do not put up with the vocal
coach. As soon as he starts chipping stop the game and
tell him in no uncertain terms these games are for the kids
to enjoy and you will not tolerate his yapping. Period.
This goes double for 7-8 yr old games. No need for you
to put up with it.

2. Never acknowledge fans. Let them b1tch and moan all they
want, don't explain, justify or discuss your calls or
noncalls with them. I know at rec games there's often
no place for you to "hide" after a game. If a fan approcahes
you and speaks to you respectfully after a game
you might answer questions courteously, but once they
start repeating themselves end the discussion. If they
want to argue just don't participate. Walk away. Nothing
good ever comes of these confrontations.

You should go to whoever is responsible for running this
league and file a report on this coach's behavior.
As you probably know dad-coaches are a dime a dozen but
good refs are difficult to find and retain in these
leagues. This coach should be booted from the league
and banned for life, IMO.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old Sun Nov 11, 2001, 01:18pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Two rules you should always follow:

1. In these rec league games do not put up with the vocal
coach. As soon as he starts chipping stop the game and
tell him in no uncertain terms these games are for the kids
to enjoy and you will not tolerate his yapping. Period.
This goes double for 7-8 yr old games. No need for you
to put up with it.

2. Never acknowledge fans. Let them b1tch and moan all they
want, don't explain, justify or discuss your calls or
noncalls with them. I know at rec games there's often
no place for you to "hide" after a game. If a fan approcahes
you and speaks to you respectfully after a game
you might answer questions courteously, but once they
start repeating themselves end the discussion. If they
want to argue just don't participate. Walk away. Nothing
good ever comes of these confrontations.

You should go to whoever is responsible for running this
league and file a report on this coach's behavior.
As you probably know dad-coaches are a dime a dozen but
good refs are difficult to find and retain in these
leagues. This coach should be booted from the league
and banned for life, IMO.
Good advice. Esp. regarding acknowledging the fans. I agree that nothing good can come from these confrontations, and I will do my best to heed this advise in the future.

The sad thing is that the league commissioner was there!! He joked that I set a record with the number of successive Techs. When I asked if he needed a report in writing he said "That coach is like that". IMO if the coach is like that then he doesn't need to be coaching.

This is my second year of officiating and I use these games to gain experience. My usual partner is also a HS official and we work these games as we would a HS game (No short-cuts) . This was the last game of the fall season for this Assoc. HS ball is beginning here in FLA (my first HS game is 11-19). If I decide to continue to work rec. games it won't be until the end of HS season, which is Feb.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old Sun Nov 11, 2001, 04:25pm
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Thumbs up Misunderstood

Me too! Send me the misunderstood rules info.

Send it to [email protected]

Thanks!!

Paul
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old Sun Nov 11, 2001, 04:36pm
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Post

In our local rec league, we go over the "most misunderstood rules" at the coaches clinic. We start with over the back, over and back, reaches, block/charge and traveling (emphasizing the "player on the floor" situation). There are a few more, including 3 seconds.

This is my 14th year on the Board, so I usually never have any trouble with coaches and/or players and/or spectators. They all pretty much know me by now, and they know I won't take any crap. A few things we do to cut down on the problems are:

1) we send home a copy of our rules to each kid's parents - these rules state in BOLD CAPS that an official or Board member can eject anyone at anytime for poor conduct (since I am both, I get to do it twice as much )

2) we have a Board member in a special shirt at all games - the moment someone starts to get even a little "out of hand", they are talked to immediately

3) we make coaches responsible for the behavior of their parents - coaches who cannot control their parents get technicals and even ejections

4) if someone gets completely out of hand (this has only happened twice in my 14 years) - we call the police and have them removed - they are then suspended for life (but we do not suspend their kid)

This year, we will have over 1400 boys and girls in our program in grades 3 - 12. Our season-opening jamboree is on Dec. 1. I'm hoping for an incident-less season.

If any of you out there are also involved in your local rec leagues and want to discuss specific situations or have questions, feel free to email me at [email protected].
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old Mon Nov 12, 2001, 04:05pm
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Art,

I too am interested in your version of misunderstood rules.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old Tue Nov 13, 2001, 07:27am
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Count me in also. I'd like the same information.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old Tue Nov 13, 2001, 06:15pm
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check new thread for "Misunderstood basketball rules"
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