Is it a Shot Clock Violation?

[RdBallRef]

A.R. 13 of the 2002 NCAA rule book, page 44, has a specific example of where an official inadvertently blows a whistle and the shot clock horn sounds while A-1's try in flight. The try does not contact the rim or flange.

Is this a shot clock violation?

I don't think it is, because the AP arrow is used (accoarding to A.R. 15 to make the ball live again via the A-P throw in. If it were a shot clock violation, the Team B would automatically by rule be entitled to the ball under 9-10.2.

In reviewing A.R. 15, the clock is reset because of 2-6.a and not because of 2-6.e, thus Team A maybe entitled to the ball back. So how can it be a violation????

Does the order of the whistle/horn, or horn/whistle come into play in that which blows first has a bearing? I know that neither shot clock horn nor the whistle makes the ball immediately dead in this situation, so possibly the order does matter. But in A.R. 15, it appears that the inadvertent whistle comes first, and then the horn goes off. The ruling is that play shall resume by the AP procedure and the shot clock is reset. Reading this I deduce that the officials whistle did kill the ball after the attempt for goal endedd. Since there is not no team control during a shot, the ball had to be made live by the A-P procedure.

Am I making this TOO complicated? SOMEBODY, HELP ME by explaining which rules apply.

Again, I don't think its a violation.......

[RdBallRef]

Sorry, its A.R. 31.......see how cofused I am over this???

[Dan_ref]

Hmm, not sure what 2-6 or A.R 15 has to do with this...

Anyway this is not a shot clock violation, if it was B
would get the ball and AP would not come into play.
There are twenty-something shot clock scenarios in the CCA
manual, take a look there to get really confused, err, to get a full understanding.

[Edited by Dan_ref on Nov 6th, 2001 at 10:32 AM]

[bigwhistle]

This is not a shot clock violation by rule. Poorly written, the AR is saying that the inadvertant whistle occurred when the shot clock horn sounded. Because of the inadvertant whistle, the AP will be used with a new shot clock.

The interesting part of the AR comes when the same senerio occurs and the shot is successful. The rule book states that under this circumstance that both the shot clock horn AND THE WHISTLE shall be ignored and play will continue. Is there any other instance where an official's whistle of any kind is ignored and play continues?

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by bigwhistle
...
The interesting part of the AR comes when the same senerio occurs and the shot is successful. The rule book states that under this circumstance that both the shot clock horn AND THE WHISTLE shall be ignored and play will continue. Is there any other instance where an official's whistle of any kind is ignored and play continues?

I saw this too. In practice, this whistle ain't gonna be
"ignored", we can all be d*mn sure that there will be
some discussion before the ball is put back in play.

[Jeremy Hohn]

Well, I have had this happen in a game to me, and I would have to say that whatever sounds first would have bearing. If you have an inadvertant whistle on a try, there isn't any team control, therefore we would go to the ap arrow. If your whistle sounds after the horn and there wasn't any rim contact then we should kill it anyway to give team "B" a fresh reset especially if they don't get it clean.

[bigwhistle]

Jeremy,

You can't automatically give the ball to Team B in this instance, even though it would be what would happen if there had not been the inadvertant whistle.

Rule 2-13-9 AR 31 b specifically covers this and calls for an AP throw-in with a new shot clock.

We all know that not everything in the rule book uses common sense or is equitable.

[Jeremy Hohn]

Thanks for the clarification, big.