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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 24, 2007, 10:19pm
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I have another question. I was always taught that if you are square with another player even if you are moving with him/her that contact is charging not blocking.
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Old Wed Jan 24, 2007, 10:23pm
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I am going to be honest with you. I do not know what you are asking. Square how?

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Old Wed Jan 24, 2007, 10:25pm
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By square, do you mean the defender has legal guarding position?
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 08:40am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 81artmonk
I was always taught that if you are square with another player even if you are moving with him/her that contact is charging not blocking.
If you asking whether you can draw the charge while moving, the answer is yes. The defender does not have to be stationary, does not even have to be touching the floor. If you are guarding a player with the ball, then all you have to do is:

1) be facing him/her initially,
2) then beat that player to the spot on the floor (unless the ballhandler is already airborne) and
3) not be moving toward the ballhandler when the contact occurs.

If those three things happen and there is contact on the torso that displaces you, it's a charge (player control foul).

The rules are a little different if you're guarding a player without the ball. In that case, you need to allow the player you're guarding time and distance to avoid the contact.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 08:49am
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I would like to add, "have position established on the floor (feet on the floor) - which puts the defender in 'legal guarding position'" to the aforementioned post. Otherwise, what Scrapper said.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 09:34am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdogrunnin
I would like to add, "have position established on the floor (feet on the floor) - which puts the defender in 'legal guarding position'" to the aforementioned post. Otherwise, what Scrapper said.
That's almost what Scapper's #1 said, Dog. That's basically the same as "facing him/her initially". Scrappy just left out the "both feet on the floor part.

Bad Scrappy. Bad, bad Scrappy!

Good addition.

Also....the guard doesn't have to be facing the opponent either when the contact occurs. He can turn or duck to absorb the contact.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 10:23am
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Does squaring up mean the same as:

ART. 2 . . . To obtain an initial legal guarding position:

a. The guard must have both feet touching the playing court.
b. The front of the guard's torso must be facing the opponent.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 10:37am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ref Daddy
Does squaring up mean the same as:

ART. 2 . . . To obtain an initial legal guarding position:

a. The guard must have both feet touching the playing court.
b. The front of the guard's torso must be facing the opponent.
No, I think that the original poster meant after LGP was established.

I think.

Maybe.

If he did, rule 4-23-3 applies.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 12:57pm
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LGP is what I meant...sorry

Sorry for the confusion, I forgot that you refs talk Ref speak. LGP was what I meant, and from your answers, I feel let down, since by definition most refs I deal with would call a player for blocking even if LGP was obtained.

Also....the guard doesn't have to be facing the opponent either when the contact occurs. He can turn or duck to absorb the contact. Based on this I see my players called for blocking almost everytime. I was always taught that if you have LGP, as you call it, that contact by the opponent is charging.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 02:42pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 81artmonk
Sorry for the confusion, I forgot that you refs talk Ref speak. LGP was what I meant, and from your answers, I feel let down, since by definition most refs I deal with would call a player for blocking even if LGP was obtained.

Also....the guard doesn't have to be facing the opponent either when the contact occurs. He can turn or duck to absorb the contact. Based on this I see my players called for blocking almost everytime. I was always taught that if you have LGP, as you call it, that contact by the opponent is charging.
You feel let down because....

I don't get your point here.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 02:47pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 81artmonk
Sorry for the confusion, I forgot that you refs talk Ref speak. LGP was what I meant, and from your answers, I feel let down, since by definition most refs I deal with would call a player for blocking even if LGP was obtained.

Also....the guard doesn't have to be facing the opponent either when the contact occurs. He can turn or duck to absorb the contact. Based on this I see my players called for blocking almost everytime.
Then I would suggest you teach (coach) your players to stop turning and ducking.
Quote:
I was always taught that if you have LGP, as you call it, that contact by the opponent is charging.
There's quite a bit a player can do to turn a charge into a block.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 03:11pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan_ref
Then I would suggest you teach (coach) your players to stop turning and ducking.

There's quite a bit a player can do to turn a charge into a block.
Sadly, this is true do to officials who do not correctly call the charge/block. We as officials are much too quick to call a foul on the defense in these situations even when the defender has LGP and is retreating.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 03:14pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eastshire
Sadly, this is true do to officials who do not correctly call the charge/block. We as officials are much too quick to call a foul on the defense in these situations even when the defender has LGP and is retreating.
I agree.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 03:59pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eastshire
Sadly, this is true do to officials who do not correctly call the charge/block. We as officials are much too quick to call a foul on the defense in these situations even when the defender has LGP and is retreating.
No, this is due to how players are coached.

I would not agree that "we" as officials are too quick or too slow to do anything.

I would only say that there's a lot a player can do to turn a charge into a block. Of course there's also a lot a player can do to maintain LGP and get the charge. How it turns out depends to a large degree on the coaching.

This coach claims he rarely gets charge calls. As I said if I were him I would take a long look at what I'm teaching.
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Old Thu Jan 25, 2007, 04:31pm
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the only time a charge turns to a block IMO -- is when the defensive players starts to fall way before the contact -- that I deem a block -- and I know by definition a flop is a T in this case but thats a bit harsh and the contact is always the same as a normal block charge call.
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