SEC may discipline referee - Ala.-Ga. game

[biz]

Originally Posted by swkansasref33

You don't do it, no matter what. If you do, and you let the whole nation know he screwed up, then EVERY game, and i mean EVERY game, coaches and players are going to question his calls, and be continually on his @$$ because of it. It would essentially be forcing this guy to quit officiating.

We're talking about a guy, Tom Lopes, who has been one of the best in the business for many years. He's worked multiple Final Fours and is one of that small, elite group who you tend to see working the big games. His record speaks for itself.

That being said...If he screwed by misapplying a rule that is a major no no and I would have no problem with a simple statement from the SEC saying that he misapplied rule x.x.x and he and his crew will receive a (x) game suspension. But in seems in this case we're talking about judgement calls that need to be made at a split second. Obviously if an official misses too many of these type calls he/she will lose assignments to officials who can make the calls, but these mistakes should not be publicized.

[deecee]

i agree -- how can you punish someone who has a split second to make a JUDGEMENT call -- and calls nonetheless that need to be reviewed in super slow mo and still will have some peoplw arguing both sides.

another case of a coach not willing to accept reality -- humas will make errors -- the less time we have to take in information and reasonably evaluate it the more chance for error -- in our industry our chance for error is very high as everything is done split second with lots of information coming in. We all know that the shot clock violation sometimes can be the MOST difficult to call depending on angles and action on the court. How can we SEE a GRAZE. very tough to be reprimanded for close call/non calls based on judgement.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by biz

That being said...If he screwed by misapplying a rule that is a major no no and I would have no problem with a simple statement from the SEC saying that he misapplied rule x.x.x and he and his crew will receive a (x) game suspension.

Why should the crew get penalized if the wrong decision on the play was Lopes' alone? It was his decision only on the replay, being the R.

[biz]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Why should the crew get penalized if the wrong decision on the play was Lopes' alone? It was his decision only on the replay, being the R.

The part of my post you quoted was in reference to the misapplication of a rule and not a judgement call. If a rule is misapplied the crew as a whole will usually take the rap, because someone on the crew is expected to step in and interpret the rule correctly for the crew.

I agree with you though in the case of a judgement call on the part of one official the whole crew should not take the blame.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by biz

We're talking about a guy, Tom Lopes, who has been one of the best in the business for many years. He's worked multiple Final Fours and is one of that small, elite group who you tend to see working the big games. His record speaks for itself.

That being said...If he screwed by misapplying a rule that is a major no no and I would have no problem with a simple statement from the SEC saying that he misapplied rule x.x.x and he and his crew will receive a (x) game suspension. But in seems in this case we're talking about judgement calls that need to be made at a split second. Obviously if an official misses too many of these type calls he/she will lose assignments to officials who can make the calls, but these mistakes should not be publicized.

I'm no expert on the NCAA rules either, but I have been looking at the monitor guidelines quite a bit recently. It may be that Lopes did, in fact, get a rule wrong, not just a judgment call. It seems that in the situation described it was incorrect to consult the monitor since the game clock was not showing 0.00, but rather still had 17 seconds on it.

Here is the NCAA rule that I am basing my statement upon:
2-5-2b

"Ascertain, with the reading of 0.00 on the game clock, whether a
shot-clock violation occurred at or near the expiration of time in any
period;"

[sj]

On another matter I'm having trouble getting my little mind around the idea that an official of his caliber, or just about any official for that matter, can make 23 bad calls in one game. The coach is bound to lose credibility when about 21 or probably 22 of these alleged bad calls were actually correct.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by sj

On another matter I'm having trouble getting my little mind around the idea that an official of his caliber, or just about any official for that matter, can make 23 bad calls in one game. The coach is bound to lose credibility when about 21 or probably 22 of these alleged bad calls were actually correct.

It can happen and did happen in a final four game a few years ago. Nobody made a public stink about it, but I was in a session where the film was broke down.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by tomegun

It can happen and did happen in a final four game a few years ago. Nobody made a public stink about it, but I was in a session where the film was broke down.

Was this the Duke/UConn men's game?

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Was this the Duke/UConn men's game?

Do I know you?

Uh, yeah that was the game. I think you know the official I'm talking about, but I will tell you this. One of the officials went on to the NBA the next season so it wasn't him messing up.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by sj

On another matter I'm having trouble getting my little mind around the idea that an official of his caliber, or just about any official for that matter, can make 23 bad calls in one game. The coach is bound to lose credibility when about 21 or probably 22 of these alleged bad calls were actually correct.

Bear in mind that there is a difference between a "bad" call and a "missed" call and a "judgmental no call", but sometimes coaches don't know the difference.