How do you respond to coach who is right but an a** about it?

[bellnier]

Here's the sitch. Girls varsity game in large gym that has regulation court plus 3 courts at right angles to main court. Gym also supports volleyball, kickball, God only knows what else. The result is that there are zillions of lines on court. Unfortunately, there is another line parallel to, and just a few inches from, the half-court line. Player in frontcourt dribbles ball just over bogus line but not on real line. Ref calls backcourt violation. Coach goes ballistic. Do you reverse the call?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bellnier

Here's the sitch. Girls varsity game in large gym that has regulation court plus 3 courts at right angles to main court. Gym also supports volleyball, kickball, God only knows what else. The result is that there are zillions of lines on court. Unfortunately, there is another line parallel to, and just a few inches from, the half-court line. Player in frontcourt dribbles ball just over bogus line but not on real line. Ref calls backcourt violation. Coach goes ballistic. Do you reverse the call?

Yes, if it's before the ensuing throw-in ends. And, I address the coach's reaction.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by bellnier

Here's the sitch. Girls varsity game in large gym that has regulation court plus 3 courts at right angles to main court. Gym also supports volleyball, kickball, God only knows what else. The result is that there are zillions of lines on court. Unfortunately, there is another line parallel to, and just a few inches from, the half-court line. Player in frontcourt dribbles ball just over bogus line but not on real line. Ref calls backcourt violation. Coach goes ballistic. Do you reverse the call?

Reverse the call, then T the coach. That way the turnover is now the coach's fault.

[Time2Ref]

I think you should go over to the calling official and tell them what you know. Then you let the calling official decide if he wants to reverse his call.

I find nothing wrong with quietly saying to a coach, "I might have booted that call. I'll try to get it right next time". (but not too early, LOL. Some coaches may see this as a sign of weakness and work on you).

The other night, I was throwing the ball in at the table. The visiting coach said something (I can't remember exactly what it was). I turned to him and said "Coach, I'm doing the best that I can out here". I thought he was going to say something like "If that's your best.....". Instead he replies quickly "You better be". It made me laugh.

[bellnier]

I was in the stands. Ref reversed call, but did not T-up apoplectic (sp?) coach. But let's say he did. After team B shoots freethrows, does team A then get to inbound on the errant backcourt call?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bellnier

I was in the stands. Ref reversed call, but did not T-up apoplectic (sp?) coach. But let's say he did. After team B shoots freethrows, does team A then get to inbound on the errant backcourt call?

Not in HS rules. The penalty for the T includes a throw-in.

Under NCAA rules, the ball returns to POI (which would be A's throw-in on the inadvertant whistle).

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Time2Ref

I think you should go over to the calling official and tell them what you know. Then you let the calling official decide if he wants to reverse his call.

I find nothing wrong with quietly saying to a coach, "I might have booted that call. I'll try to get it right next time". (but not too early, LOL. Some coaches may see this as a sign of weakness and work on you).

The other night, I was throwing the ball in at the table. The visiting coach said something (I can't remember exactly what it was). I turned to him and said "Coach, I'm doing the best that I can out here". I thought he was going to say something like "If that's your best.....". Instead he replies quickly "You better be". It made me laugh.

I think the OP was asking a basic question about reversing a call that we (officials) would make in error. I don't think the OP meant would you go and reverse your partner's call.

Additionally, I cringe (inside) when I hear officials say, "We are going to work hard...", "We are going to do a good job for you" and especially "I'm doing the best I can..." I would say just leave those statements alone.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by bellnier

I was in the stands. Ref reversed call, but did not T-up apoplectic (sp?) coach. But let's say he did. After team B shoots freethrows, does team A then get to inbound on the errant backcourt call?

Nope, that's why I said earlier:

Reverse the call, then T the coach. That way the turnover is now the coach's fault.

B/c now, the coach's ignorant response will be the reason his team will not retain possession. I'm sure most of us have worked games with confusing lines. The coaches also know that the lines are confusing. Going ballistic over an honest and correctable mistake serves no purpose.

[bellnier]

Thanks all. Sadly, the coach in question is a local sports legend (having played pro ball) and gets a little too much leeway at times.

[Junker]

I agree with the post that said go tell your partner what you know. It's up to them if they change it or not. There's nothing wrong with telling a coach you might have booted a call on occasion, but if they continue to be a jerk about it, step back and T them. Last year, we had a really good conference matchup in a conference I work often. Both coaches had and deserved the reputation of being a pain. Early in the game, we had a too patient situation that caused my partner and I to miss a foul. The H player involved then got frustrated, lost his head, and committed an intentional foul. I rotated over to the coach and told him exactly what happened, why it happened, and that indeed my partner and I missed a call. He thanked me for being honest and we didn't really have many problems with him the rest of the night.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by bellnier

Thanks all. Sadly, the coach in question is a local sports legend (having played pro ball) and gets a little too much leeway at times.

It sounds as if Coach needs to learn acceptable behavior at the level he's working.

[bellnier]

This was an early season, non-league contest and everyone involved was more than a little off. I've seen both those refs as well as both teams since then and they've all upped their game. The coach, however, is the same boorish lout...never changes...I don't know if this is a learned behavior or genetically imprinted.

[Dan_ref]

btw (and I hope Tom is listening) this is a great time for the off official to give the coach the quick (.76 seconds is the record?) stop sign and announce that he needs to calm down, we'll take care of it.

As far as I'm concerned any response that is not close to "OK, thanks" earns a T.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

btw (and I hope Tom is listening) this is a great time for the off official to give the coach the quick (.76 seconds is the record?) stop sign and announce that he needs to calm down, we'll take care of it.

As far as I'm concerned any response that is not close to "OK, thanks" earns a T.

I hear you Dan. My crusade is nearly over. Truth be told, it isn't so much the use of the stop sign as it is the robotic nature of thinking the stop sign is a must or a mandatory step before a coach gets a T.

To bring up something entirely different, there is a guy from the DC area that has a different take on this whole stop sign thing. He belongs to many leagues - I mean many - and is an evaluator for the NBA. He is not perfect as an official so these comments must be taken with a grain of salt. His take was a two-handed defensive or calm down approach is better than a big old stop sign. Just another possibility.

[biz]

Originally Posted by Time2Ref

I find nothing wrong with quietly saying to a coach, "I might have booted that call. I'll try to get it right next time". (but not too early, LOL. Some coaches may see this as a sign of weakness and work on you).

As a coach I have great respect for officials who are willing to admit they might have missed a call. I'm not perfect as a coach and I understand (as an official and a coach) that officials are not perfect.

As an official I have no problem with telling a coach I might have missed one if I think I missed it. I also don't have a problem admitting the same to the players on the floor. I think, in general, it makes the guys/gals in stripes seem more like people and not like the enemy.