Which Way do you prefer????

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Old School

Well, I really hate to bust your bubble but there is a Rule 6.3 Art.6 of the NFHS rulebook. Read it and sweep son, last sentence.

Objection overruled!!!! Case is closed......

Unfortunately it's been overturned on appeal and remanded back based on the judge being removed from the case.

There is a Rule 6-3-6. But 6.3.6 refers to case plays, and there is no case play 6.3.6.

But let's go back to your original statements - you are changing your story by first saying you would blow the toss dead because both jumpers swung and missed the toss, now you are quoting the rule that the toss should be blown dead when the ball has not touched either jumper before hitting the floor. So, um, which are you saying?

You've admitted to being a player, but you have not yet admitted to being an official. You've admitted to being at a camp, but not whether it was as an official or player. Do you actually officiate, and at what levels?

[BEAREF]

Originally Posted by jontheref

Just practicing outside my tosses for the start of the season. Just interested in what is the popular approach.

A-- One hand overhead and push (the Steve Wehlmer approach)
B-- Two hand underhand (The Jim Burr method)
C-- One hand underhand

Which do you think is more accurate???

For the life of me I cannot figure out why there has been 78 posts for this very simple question.

Personally, I use the two hand underhanded and practice it by standing beneath the basket and tossing it up through the net. The goal is to have it go up and down with minimal movement of the net. In my opinion it's a great way to practice.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by BEAREF

For the life of me I cannot figure out why there has been 78 posts for this very simple question.

Good question.

Anyway, fwiw, I've used both the one-handed and two-handed tosses. Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don't.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Good question.

Anyway, fwiw, I've used both the one-handed and two-handed tosses. Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don't.

....where is that damn squirrel picture when you need it...

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Case book play 6.3.7 on p.47 of the case book.

JR, this case play is saying the same thing I'm saying. Retoss if the ball hits the floor untouched which is very likely to happen if both jumpers go up really hard for the tip and miss it, thus falling off balance from the effort of trying to tip the ball, and the ball drops to the floor. I have seen this many times. I will kill it if the toss is extremely high, and the jumpers have no chance of getting to it. Again, you can toss the ball to the ceiling and this is legal by the rules, but what I'm advocating here is a little common sense to go along with the rule. No foul has been committed, no violation has occur, no team has an advantage from retossing. So what's the big deal? The tossing official got a little egg on his face because he has to retoss. Who cares? Get over yourself, it is not about you.

Don't judge a book by it's cover....

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

....where is that damn squirrel picture when you need it...

You can always count on the squirrel! At least up to 2.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

I hate to break it to you, but there ain't no 6.3.6. That isn't a rule; that's a case play number that doesn't exist.

Here's what we need re: jump balls:
1) #212 on p.28 of the OFFICIALS MANUAL.
2) Case book play 6.3.7 on p.47 of the case book.

Now, prove to us that you really, really are an official. Look those up and cite them for us.

I await your response.

Bump....

Still waiting....

All you have to do is write out the complete citations.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Old School

JR, this case play is saying the same thing I'm saying. Retoss if the ball hits the floor untouched which is very likely to happen if both jumpers go up really hard for the tip and miss it, thus falling off balance from the effort of trying to tip the ball, and the ball drops to the floor. I have seen this many times. I will kill it if the toss is extremely high, and the jumpers have no chance of getting to it. Again, you can toss the ball to the ceiling and this is legal by the rules, but what I'm advocating here is a little common sense to go along with the rule. No foul has been committed, no violation has occur, no team has an advantage from retossing. So what's the big deal? The tossing official got a little egg on his face because he has to retoss. Who cares? Get over yourself, it is not about you.

Don't judge a book by it's cover....

If it hits the floor untouched, then you have to retoss. If the players jump, then land, then tap the ball. Don't call it back. I won't be upset that you make me look bad, because you haven't. You've made yourself look like an idiot for not knowing the rules. I'll be upset that my partner is more interested in the game looking pretty than in enforcing the rules as written.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Old School

Don't judge a book by it's cover....

Absolutely correct. Always judge the content.

And so far, that's been easy.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Old School

JR, this case play is saying the same thing I'm saying. Retoss if the ball hits the floor untouched which is very likely to happen if both jumpers go up really hard for the tip and miss it, thus falling off balance from the effort of trying to tip the ball, and the ball drops to the floor. I have seen this many times. I will kill it if the toss is extremely high, and the jumpers have no chance of getting to it.

I'm a little confused. You say "retoss if the ball hits the floor untouched" (I agree with this), but also that you will "kill it if the toss is extremely high" without waiting to see if the ball hits the floor untouched.

Also, you say that you "have seen this many times" but also that "90+ percent of the officials don't toss the ball hight enough" (this last quote might be off a little -- it's from a previous post that I didn't go back and find).

Please clarify.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I'm a little confused. You say "retoss if the ball hits the floor untouched" (I agree with this), but also that you will "kill it if the toss is extremely high" without waiting to see if the ball hits the floor untouched.

Also, you say that you "have seen this many times" but also that "90+ percent of the officials don't toss the ball hight enough" (this last quote might be off a little -- it's from a previous post that I didn't go back and find).

Please clarify.

Bob, I never said I would kill it without waiting to see if the ball hits the floor. You assume that I did this. 90% of the tosses that are too high and the jumpers extend themselve to get it, the ball ends up coming back down to the floor untouched.

When I toss the ball for men's, I toss the ball up too or above the square over the rim. All of my tosses are tipped at its highest point or while it is going up, but way above the rim. I always tell the jumpers right there, "way to get up baby!", "good jump" and yes there feet is up around my head.

It is my opinion that the ball needs to be toss slightly higher than the jumpers can jump which is at least to the top of the drawn out square over the rim on the backboard. Not to the 10' rim. If you're tossing to the 10' rim, you are not tossing the ball high enough for college men's basketball and for most high school varsity boys contests. It is my opinion, and I am teaching this to officials that it is a good toss when both jumpers extend themselves and hits the ball while it is up in the air way above the height of the rim, because most jumpers can get up way above the rim. This looks good, it looks the best, and both teams gets an equal opportuntiy to get the toss. Most tosses that I see are not high enough at this level. Most jumps I see that are too high and the jumpers extend themselves. The ball falls to the floor untouched. I take off for both of these. Officials when tossing needs to analyze briefly what type of jumpers they are going to have for the jump. If it's women, definitely don't need to toss it that high. Tossing it to the ten foot rim for women is too high. If it's men and they are both over 6'6, you need to get it up there.

Is it the end of the world if the toss doesn't go up high enough? No, play on.
Is it worth the discussion that we have had on this subject to the degree that we have had? Yes, because I have learned so much more by engaging you all on this subject. Discussion makes me a better and more informed official.

Don't kill the messenger....

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

When I toss the ball for men's, I toss the ball up too or above the square over the rim. All of my tosses are tipped at its highest point or while it is going up, but way above the rim. I always tell the jumpers right there, "way to get up baby!", "good jump" and yes there feet is up around my head.

You tell the jumpers "good jump" when they commit a violation?

Basic rule, OldFool. It's a violation for a jumper to hit the ball on the way up. Always has been. In every league in the world too.

You just get more ridiculous with every post. You don't even know the basic rules, Troll.

[BEAREF]

It seems as though 90% is OldSchool's favorite number. I think he's used that percentage in 90% of his posts on this subject...and for the record I disregard at least 90% of what he's said.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

You tell the jumpers "good jump" when they commit a violation?

Basic rule, OldFool. It's a violation for a jumper to hit the ball on the way up. Always has been. In every league in the world too.

You just get more ridiculous with every post. You don't even know the basic rules, Troll.

Most jumps are not tossed high enough. Do you agree? If this is the case, then why are you not calling this? I want to know how many times you have called a violation when the ball is touched before it reaches it highest point or the fact that the toss does not go up high enough? Think about that b4 you go an call someone a fool.

Again, don't kill the messenger...it is just a discussion

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Old School

Most jumps are not tossed high enough. Do you agree?

No. Some are not tossed high enough. But most? More than 50%? No, I don't agree.

I want to know how many times you have called a violation when the ball is touched before it reaches it highest point or the fact that the toss does not go up high enough?

Violations -- 2 this season. Both college games. One was a D2 team.
Bad tosses -- 0 this season. Haven't seen it yet.

Again, don't kill the messenger.

You don't have a message. You just spout ridiculous statements.