Center Toss

[johnnyrao]

Boys JH game last night. I am the R. I toss the ball up and wait to see which direction it is goin. As I glance up I see A1 (Team A's center) holding the ball with two hands then toss it to a teammate. I wait for a whistle from one of my partners but it never comes. I know this is not the R's call, but in this situation would you quickly put your whislte in your mouth and call it? I did not. I also had to listen to the Team B coach since I became the T right in front of his bench. He was right on this one. At halftime U1 said he thought the center just tapped it with both hands and U2 said he did not see it. Any advice for me for the future if I am the R? Looking back, I think I probably should have called it.

[wfd21]

I would give my partner first shot, then if no call, find my whistle and make the call, cause my whistle is not in my mouth when I toss.

[eyezen]

OT Reply:

Which state do you work in that has three man in JH?

[Back In The Saddle]

So... you're using the toss, duck, and cover method?

[johnnyrao]

Originally Posted by eyezen

OT Reply:

Which state do you work in that has three man in JH?

Alabama. In some schools we do it by choice and split the money three ways. We do high school with three so we also do JH with three to work on it and train newer officials.

I appreciate all the responses. To cut through to the meat of what I learned in this thread, it is that in the future, even though it may be a late whistle, I will call it if I know for sure what I saw. Also, I learned a two hand touch is legal. It may never happen but now I know that if it does happen I am ready for it.

Finally, I have never been to a camp so I am going off of my training and what I have learned from this web site. As the R, I toss the ball and, no I usually do not look up. I have practiced my toss and almost always get a good one. I don't look up until late because I was told that is a good way to get a broken nose from tall players. I also do not have my whistle in my mouth. If this is not correct then what is the correct way to do it?

[Old School]

Originally Posted by johnnyrao

Alabama.
I have practiced my toss and almost always get a good one. I don't look up until late because I was told that is a good way to get a broken nose from tall players. I also do not have my whistle in my mouth. If this is not correct then what is the correct way to do it?

If you don't look up, how do you know if the toss is straight? How do you know if the toss reached it's highest point before a jumper tipped it with 2 hands? To me, you have to look up. If somethings wrong, you're right there to see it and you always have the option to re-toss your own toss.

Don't worry about getting hit by a jumper. Worry about getting your toss right, straight and high enough. The whistle should not be in your mouth. Last thing, be observant as you toss. If you see something coming at you, elbow, foot, wild swinging arm, get your hand up and protect yourself. With the boys/men, separate them a bit at the circle. They do not need to be right up against each other for your toss. That space in between is for you and it will help keep them from contacting you with a body part when you release the ball to start the jump.

[Adam]

Worry about protecting yourself. Your partner has this call for a reason; it's a better angle than you have.

[Old School]

Far as I'm concerned, all 3 of you dinked this up. Something that is not taught at all is the jump ball procedure. You tossed the ball and then you glanced up! That must have been one heck of a toss. When you toss the ball you should be looking up to make sure the jumpers don't touch the ball before it reaches it highest point. You also need to look up to make sure you tossed it straight. That way if someone grabs it, you are right there to see it.

Granted your partners are responsible to make this call, if they don't, then it's okay for you to call it, if you have defiant knowledge. Also, your toss may not have been high enough if one of the jumpers tipped it with two hands, which I don't think is legal anyway. You toss the ball high enough, they can't jump up and tip it with two hands.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

1) Also, your toss may not have been high enough if one of the jumpers tipped it with two hands, which I don't think is legal anyway.

2)You toss the ball high enough, they can't jump up and tip it with two hands.

Good Lord, JThomas from McGriffs comes out of retirement...and still doesn't own a rulebook.

1) Borrow a book from somebody and look up what a jumper can legally do. As usual, you're completely wrong. There has NEVER been a rule in any ruleset stating that you can't tip a ball with 2 hands on a jump.

2) That statement ties for the dumbest one ever made on this forum. Why can't they can't tip it with 2 hands? Isn't the ball gonna come back down? Ever heard of "gravity"?

Lah me....

[Old School]

[2) That statement ties for the dumbest one ever made on this forum. Why can't they can't tip it with 2 hands? Isn't the ball gonna come back down? Ever heard of "gravity"?

Lah me....[/QUOTE]

I hate to ask what was the dumbest if you think that was dumb.

Why can't you tip the ball with both hands? Because it might look like you caught it and beep, other way. Because if your coach sees this, you might not be the jumper anymore for your team. We don't have to worry about the between the lines in the rulebook JR. So technically, I guess you are correct, but realistically, it might not be that smart for a jumper to do.

Isn't the ball gonna come back down? Ever heard of gravity? Oh my, I got to respond to that. The objective of the jump ball procedure is to toss the ball high enough so that the ball is touched by one or both jumper at it's highest point. If that doesn't happen, than it probably wasn't a good toss.

Like I said, jump ball procedure needs to be taught and you can't learn that in a rulebook, JR, aka referee hater.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Old School

[2) That statement ties for the dumbest one ever made on this forum. Why can't they can't tip it with 2 hands? Isn't the ball gonna come back down? Ever heard of "gravity"?

Lah me....

I hate to ask what was the dumbest if you think that was dumb.

Why can't you tip the ball with both hands? Because it might look like you caught it and beep, other way. Because if your coach sees this, you might not be the jumper anymore for your team. We don't have to worry about the between the lines in the rulebook JR. So technically, I guess you are correct, but realistically, it might not be that smart for a jumper to do.[/quote]

Just because the coach might not want the jumper to do so, doesn't mean it doesn't happen or that it's illegal -- as you "thought'" it might be.

Isn't the ball gonna come back down? Ever heard of gravity? Oh my, I got to respond to that. The objective of the jump ball procedure is to toss the ball high enough so that the ball is touched by one or both jumper at it's highest point. If that doesn't happen, than it probably wasn't a good toss.

It's supposed to be touched "AFTER" it reaches its highest point, not "AT" its highest point. And, a "good" toss can be "stolen" (illegal, but it's still a good toss) or touched on the way back down.

Like I said, jump ball procedure needs to be taught

Agreed. It doesn't look good if the game starts with a mistake by the officials.

[Old School]

Bob Jenkins says; Just because the coach might not want the jumper to do so, doesn't mean it doesn't happen or that it's illegal -- as you "thought'" it might be.

If I "THOUGHT" he caught the ball Bob instead of tipping it with 2 hands, we're going the other way. Are we being a little anal here?

Bob says; It's supposed to be touched "AFTER" it reaches its highest point, not "AT" its highest point.

Seriously Bob, you need to get out more! There is life outside of basketball, seriously, there is! I going to recommend that you and JR spend some quality time with a member of the opposite sex.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

Like I said, jump ball procedure needs to be taught and you can't learn that in a rulebook, JR, aka referee hater.

You got that one completely wrong, JThomas. I don't hate referees. You aren't a referee and you never have been a referee. You certainly don't own the current rulebooks either, do you? I don't like people that pose as officials and have never officiated a game in their life, but still choose to disseminate false and misleading information. That would be you.

[rockyroad]

Hey JR, I liked the part where he told the OP'er that it was bad that he tosses it and then glanced up, but then went on to tell the OP'er that he should look up to make sure it's a good toss, yada, yada, yada...don't do it, but do it? Interesting...

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Old School

Granted your partners are responsible to make this call, if they don't, then it's okay for you to call it, if you have defiant knowledge.

Why does one have to know about disobedience in order to make this call?