The chicken or the egg??

[Brian Watson]

Here is a phiosophical question asked of me last night...

Is it possible for A1 to be called for a 5 second closely guarded situation while in the lane for all 5 seconds?

[JeffRef]

Originally posted by Brian Watson
Here is a phiosophical question asked of me last night...

Is it possible for A1 to be called for a 5 second closely guarded situation while in the lane for all 5 seconds?

I can't imagine any game situation where I wouldn't have a 3 count first. I tried very hard (I thought for 5 minutes or so). And who's asking you these types of questions anyway???

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Brian Watson
Here is a phiosophical question asked of me last night...

Is it possible for A1 to be called for a 5 second closely guarded situation while in the lane for all 5 seconds?

Sure, if you count the 5 in metric seconds & the 3 in
normal units!

[twoblindrefs]

I can't get to three.....but find a way to get to 5....just kidding....3 sec violation....no way can you call the 5 sec

[JeffRef]

Sure, if you count the 5 in metric seconds & the 3 in
normal units!
[/B][/QUOTE]

Allright, I've heard enough metric bashing. It's time for rebuttal...

1 kilometre = 1000 metres
1 metre = 100 centimetres
1 centimetre = 10 millimetres
1 millimetre = the tip of a ball point pen

See how easy this is...all multiples of 10. This works for weight and volume measures too.

Now you do the same comparing a mile to a yard to a foot to an inch (no calculators allowed).

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Brian Watson
Here is a phiosophical question asked of me last night...

Is it possible for A1 to be called for a 5 second closely guarded situation while in the lane for all 5 seconds?

...technically, there's no reason why you couldn't. Given that a player in the lane may be given an allowance for moving for a goal, it is possible to have a 5 second count.

But I ain't callin' it!

[JeffRef]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

...technically, there's no reason why you couldn't. Given that a player in the lane may be given an allowance for moving for a goal, it is possible to have a 5 second count.

But I ain't callin' it!

Nobody gets an additional 2 seconds for a shot attempt. Wouldn't you have a 3 second call?

[Brian Watson]

The guy brought this up because of a game he had.

He said the kid was in the lane for at leat 7 seconds, so he called a 3 second violation. The coach went nuts, rightfully so, because the kid was advancing to the basket (I wasn't there, but he agreed the kid was technically moving in). His thinking was the kid was in there for much longer than 3, so he bailed and took the easy way out.

Later in the game, the same thing happended, so instead of calling 3, he called a 5 second closely guarded.

Apparently the coach did not say one word.


I had never thought of this situation, but it is good to think about.

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by JeffRef

Nobody gets an additional 2 seconds for a shot attempt. Wouldn't you have a 3 second call?

Sure they do. If the player is attempting to get a shot off with numerous moves, pump fakes, etc., he does, most certainly, get an additional 2, 3, 4, 5 seconds or more

NF 9-7
...Allowance shall be made for a player who, having been in the restricted area for less than three seconds, dribbles in or moves to try for goal.

But a lot of rookie officials will ignore this rule and call three seconds.

[JeffRef]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

...technically, there's no reason why you couldn't. Given that a player in the lane may be given an allowance for moving for a goal, it is possible to have a 5 second count.

But I ain't callin' it!

So a kid can just pump fake til the shot clock runs out?

If a kid has the ball close to 3 secs then decides to "dribble in or move to try for goal" sure I give him the benefit of the rule but once his initial move or try is not successful and he starts another move, pump fake, or whatever...he has violated.

"Jimmy, since BktBallRef is doing the game tonight, when you get the ball in the key, just keep pump faking or pivoting until you get a good try for goal. He won't blow his whistle". (this touch of sarcasm is for the "rookie official" comment...not appreciated )

[Brian Watson]

Originally posted by JeffRef

So a kid can just pump fake til the shot clock runs out?

...but once his initial move or try is not successful and he starts another move, pump fake, or whatever...he has violated.

"[/B]

Jeff -

I think that you would only want to call this if he passes out of the lane. If he/she is advancing to the bucket, you should let them go until:

1. they pass
2. they shoot

Multiple moves and or pump fakes are still part of advancing to the bucket.

[mick]

Originally posted by JeffRef

"Jimmy, since BktBallRef is doing the game tonight, when you get the ball in the key, just keep pump faking or pivoting until you get a good try for goal. He won't blow his whistle". (this touch of sarcasm is for the "rookie official" comment...not appreciated )

JeffRef,
Tony wasn't rippin' you.
When he rips, he is usually much less subtle.
I think he was talking about generic rookie mistakes.
mick

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by JeffRef
So a kid can just pump fake til the shot clock runs out?

There is no shot clock where I officiate but I defy you to site a rule that states how long a player who is in the lane can pump fake.

"Jimmy, since BktBallRef is doing the game tonight, when you get the ball in the key, just keep pump faking or pivoting until you get a good try for goal. He won't blow his whistle".

Sure I will. TWEET! 5 seconds!

...(this touch of sarcasm is for the "rookie official" comment...not appreciated )

My comment wasn't meat to be critical of you. My comment was meant to point out that most rookie officials call 3 seconds more in one game than most veteran officials call it in a season. They don't know or, maybe it's that, they don't understand the rule. Evidently, that shoe fits you or you wouldn't have slipped it on.

If you get mad that easily, perhaps you should consider a new avocation.

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Brian Watson
I think that you would only want to call this if he passes out of the lane. If he/she is advancing to the bucket, you should let them go until:

1. they pass
2. they shoot

Multiple moves and or pump fakes are still part of advancing to the bucket.

Ah, the voice of a veteran. Next time you're in NC, let's work a few games, Brian!

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by JeffRef


Allright, I've heard enough metric bashing. It's time for rebuttal...

1 kilometre = 1000 metres
1 metre = 100 centimetres
1 centimetre = 10 millimetres
1 millimetre = the tip of a ball point pen

See how easy this is...all multiples of 10. This works for weight and volume measures too.

Now you do the same comparing a mile to a yard to a foot to an inch (no calculators allowed).

OK, I will. One mile - the distance from your parking space to the gym in a blizzard. One yard - the distance A1 claims was between him and B1 when he got called for smacking B1 on the arm during a shot. One foot - the object that's usually out of the proper free throw box by all six players in the lane prior to the free throw. One inch - the size of a coach's ego after I whack him.

BTW - in pronouncing metre, do you pronounce the "r" and then the "e" is silent, or do you transpose the sounds of the letters at the end of the word? I'm still trying to figure out how to pronounce "centre". I'm just glad we don't have the positions "forwadr" and "guadr".

Also BTW - is it true that FIBA stands for "Foreign Interference in Basketball American"?