Oh I'm upset

[TussAgee11]

Originally posted by mj

I agree. While he may have been wrong to address you, you were also wrong with what you yelled. Especially if you are an official. You MUST have self-control when watching.

To answer your question, no I would not eject for that.

MJ - Thanks for the feedback - This is what I'm looking for people, at what point do you draw the lines with fans.

not just assuming I'm an idiot. Cause I'm not. Thanks MJ.

[Dan_ref]

So what's the moral of this story?

Fan got tossed from his seat that he paid money for.

Offical got paid $500+ to toss him.

OK, now for the on-topic bit:

"Over the weekend, on a quail hunting trip, Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot a fellow hunter, a 78-year-old lawyer. When people found out he shot a lawyer, his popularity is now 98 percent." —Jay Leno

[mick]

Originally posted by Dan_ref


So what's the moral of this story?

Fan got tossed from his seat that he paid money for.

Offical got paid $500+ to toss him.

OK, now for the on-topic bit:

"Over the weekend, on a quail hunting trip, Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot a fellow hunter, a 78-year-old lawyer. When people found out he shot a lawyer, his popularity is now 98 percent." —Jay Leno

Good one, Dan !
However, "NOW I KNOW WHERE YOUR MIND IS, FOCUS ...."
mick

[Time2Ref]

That is the funniest story I have ever read on this site.


LOLOLOL.

Here is the part that I liked so much:

Next whistle he goes to the table and someone comes over and takes me out of the building.

Had front row tickets, huh?

Next time, wear your striped shirt. Bet you didn't get stuck in traffic on the way home.

I can't stop laughing.

OK. But seriously, missed the end of close game, huh? Sorry to hear that.

[TussAgee11]

all i was looking for is some officiated feedback on how much the officials should just not focus on the fans.

Oh yea, paid nothing for the tickets. Sit in the student section.

[Dribble]

Since you're in the student section I'm going to make a wild assumption and guess that you're a student. Probably not a big leap...

Anyway, by any chance, did you consume any alcoholic beverages which may have impaired your judgment? If so, then maybe the ref going over to the table and you getting ejected are just a coincidence. Did you do anything else that may have gotten you tossed? How are you sure that the official knew it was you that screamed that comment? Was he turned around at that instant and did you two make eye contact? Did he recognize your voice from earlier comments in the game?

Could game management/security think you were drunk and acting out of line?

You have conflicting statements in that you're saying you were there to watch how a 3-man game is called and you have very little experience with it, so how do you know that the extra switching/rotations were due to the ref's incompetence? I've worked with a lot of new officials and teaching them 3-whistle isn't easy, and it takes quite a number of games for some to pick up the nuances of when to move and where to be looking.

Now to play Devil's Advocate, the official probably shouldn't have turned around and addressed the crowd if the play was still going on. I'll agree with you there. No question that you could possibly miss an important play, but there are those instances when you can peak away (not that I'm condoning it). i.e. overload on the weak side, hot girl in the stands, etc.

[Time2Ref]

Sorry. I just thought I was going to read about some rules interpretation. You setup the situation. Then Wham! It just seemed like a punchline. I couldn't stop laughing.

I have been watching basketball for longer than I would like to mention. I have watched my kids play sports. I have coached my kids teams. I have just started to learn officiating. (I can't seem to start a sentence with anything but I...this can't turn out good).

My mentor has me go watch him officiate. It was the hardest thing to do at first. I wanted to watch the games as a fan. I wanted to root for the underdog(teams I didn't even care about) I wanted to tell the coaches when to call TO's. And yes, I had problems keeping my mouth shut when there was a bad call. (at least I didn't scream).

But I have learned to keep my mouth shut. Or even make ugly faces.

He officiated a game at the deaf school. It was eerie. Not only did the deaf players NOT talk, the other team didn't talk. Nobody in the gym said anything. Sitting in the stands, I said something to myself about the AP arrow being wrong. The couple in front of my turned around and let me know that the arrow was correct and told me why. (in a nice way, but) I felt a little embarassed. People could talk, they just didn't. Strange.

Another time, his partner didn't show up. He officiated the first game by himself. Poor guy. You think an official can't see everything when there is two or three of them? He tried to play lead on both sides. He quickly learned that when you're the only one out there, you are ALWAYS the trail. No bump and run. Just run. He actually asked me to stand by one of the endlines and help him out on OOB. I politely declined. If I only learned one thing, I learned to keep my mouth shut. Actually, the crowd and coaches went pretty easy on him. (But those girls did stretch the court out when the ball was under the basket).

Another time, he had a JV boys game. I sat right behind the home team bench. First half, He was the lead (became the trail after the home team rebounded) A1 gets trapped in the corner, right in front of the Home team bench (and I was seeing what the coach was seeing). With my mentor OOB on the endline, A1 had his back to the endline. B1 and B2 where hacking away at A1's arm until the ball finally came loose. Then in the scramble, the ball went OOB, off of A1. The coach about blew his top. I thought, man that was a bad call. A1 got robbed. BUT, I didn't say anything. I made a note on my clipboard and I was going to mention it to him later. But the more I thought about it, I realized that unless he could see through that kid's body, there was no way that he could have seen the hack's. Even though it was "as plain as day" to me and the home team bench. I learned two things that night. 1) The ref can only call what he sees. 2) It is important to place yourself so that you can see the play.

I have always loved basketball. But it is a totally different game when you are watching the officials instead of the game. You can learn a lot from watching the officials instead of getting caught up in the game as a fan. But, the first that you have to learn is: Keep your mouth shut.

See how you felt when you thought we were making fun of you. Do you relize now how the ref felt when you were making fun of him?

Did you learn anything from your experience?

[Edited by Time2Ref on Feb 14th, 2006 at 08:13 AM]

[TussAgee11]

Yeah, I learned from this expierience. And no, I had no alcohol, although I'm sure some people around me did. Perhaps the official heard someone else say something and just got the wrong person. I'm not really sure. I know I should have bit my lip.

But all this said, how much should officials put the earmuffs on the crowd? And what point does it become so large you need to eject a fan. I guess its kind of like a Technical or an ejection in baseball, each referee has their own breaking point. But what should we strive for that breaking point to be? Is it different from coaches to fans? Can a fan get away with a lot worse before he/she needs to be removed?

My experience aside, I want to learn from this from an official standpoint as well. When is enough enough from a fan?

[Junker]

Originally posted by Snaqwells

I'm on it. Junker can bring the beer.

Adam,
I'm thinking you should bring both since I had to find subs for you in 3 games, and then find a sub for your sub in 2 of those. And then I had a coach tell me to stick to Saturday morning games. I hope you're enjoying the new location!

[SmokeEater]

Originally posted by TussAgee11
....
My experience aside, I want to learn from this from an official standpoint as well. When is enough enough from a fan?

Enough is when I have decided I won't take anymore! Personal judgement.

[Junker]

There are a lot of variables as to when enough is enough. It depends on the level of the game, the noise level, the official, what is said. The point is, when you make comments like this, you are putting yourself in danger of getting asked to leave, especially when you are close enough that the official can specifically point you out. I used to yell and scream at my college games. Then I worked my first 3 minutes of a basektball game and realized what I thought I was seeing from the stands was not at all what was happening on the floor. I haven't yelled at an official since, although I removed myself from a league game after an official booted a rule, but that's an entirely different story.

Originally posted by TussAgee11
Yeah, I learned from this expierience. And no, I had no alcohol, although I'm sure some people around me did. Perhaps the official heard someone else say something and just got the wrong person. I'm not really sure. I know I should have bit my lip.

But all this said, how much should officials put the earmuffs on the crowd? And what point does it become so large you need to eject a fan. I guess its kind of like a Technical or an ejection in baseball, each referee has their own breaking point. But what should we strive for that breaking point to be? Is it different from coaches to fans? Can a fan get away with a lot worse before he/she needs to be removed?

My experience aside, I want to learn from this from an official standpoint as well. When is enough enough from a fan?

What? I can't hear anything you are saying, you are a fan.

I choose not to hear anything that the fans say other than to get a laugh out of it. I have had a partner stop the game in transition as he ran by the students section once and eject a girl in the 2nd row for standing up and loudly saying "You s@#k." But personally I will not 'hear' what the fans say, if it gets bad enough,(cusring, threatening, etc..) I will go to game management at a break and have them remove the person responsible. But I wouldn't ever turn around and address the fans, let game management deal with it.

[WhistlesAndStripes]

SO which one was it?

Officals: Bryan Kersey, Doug Sirmons, Roger Ayers

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally posted by Dan_ref


So what's the moral of this story?

Fan got tossed from his seat that he paid money for.

Offical got paid $500+ to toss him.

OK, now for the on-topic bit:

"Over the weekend, on a quail hunting trip, Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot a fellow hunter, a 78-year-old lawyer. When people found out he shot a lawyer, his popularity is now 98 percent." —Jay Leno

Actually, according to Leno, it was only 92%.

[Tim Roden]

I can remember a game at the Air Force academy that I went to with my association. The officials had talked to us before the game so they knew we were there. We sat half way up the bleachers yelling things at them like, "Call it both ways." and "3 seconds" and just having a good time. They laughed and we laughed the whole game. Air Force lost big.

Be careful what you say though when the ref doesn't know you from Adam. That's when you get tossed.