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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 11:30am
MPLAHE
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Had this situation a few weeks back:

Fast break/ breakaway situation. A1 going in for a lay-up on the right side of the basket and puts the ball high up on the glass. As the ball hits the glass, B1 comes in for the block and slaps the backboard, but does not hit the ball. The ball did not go in. I was the T and was a few steps in the frontcourt and passed on the call. Coach A goes nuts, calling for basket interference.

At the next dead ball, the coach is screaming for an explanation to my partner. My partner told him it wasn’t his call. I came over and said, in my opinion there was no basket interference.

After the game, my partner told me I blew it (not very diplomatically BTW). He said it should have been called BI. I was not completely comfortable that I had it right so all I said was I thought it wasn’t since the ball was not on the rim and there was no contact with the ball.

I went back and researched it and wanted to make sure my interpretation is correct. I believe now, based on the rule, I had two options – no calling it, which I did, or calling a technical if, in my opinion, he deliberately slapped the backboard. My interpretation of the rule is that touching the rim, net or backboard does not necessitate a BI call unless the ball is touching the rim. Also, B1 never touched the ball so that was not an option either. Am I correct?
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 11:35am
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Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE
Had this situation a few weeks back:

Fast break/ breakaway situation. A1 going in for a lay-up on the right side of the basket and puts the ball high up on the glass. As the ball hits the glass, B1 comes in for the block and slaps the backboard, but does not hit the ball. The ball did not go in. I was the T and was a few steps in the frontcourt and passed on the call. Coach A goes nuts, calling for basket interference.

At the next dead ball, the coach is screaming for an explanation to my partner. My partner told him it wasn’t his call. I came over and said, in my opinion there was no basket interference.

After the game, my partner told me I blew it (not very diplomatically BTW). He said it should have been called BI. I was not completely comfortable that I had it right so all I said was I thought it wasn’t since the ball was not on the rim and there was no contact with the ball.

I went back and researched it and wanted to make sure my interpretation is correct. I believe now, based on the rule, I had two options – no calling it, which I did, or calling a technical if, in my opinion, he deliberately slapped the backboard. My interpretation of the rule is that touching the rim, net or backboard does not necessitate a BI call unless the ball is touching the rim. Also, B1 never touched the ball so that was not an option either. Am I correct?
I don't need to call BI or GT very often (sixth grade girls don't have a lot of play above the rim!), but this principle I do know: If all the player did was slap the backboard, you've got a T or nothing. For the rest of your questions, I'll cede the floor to the gentleman from Nevada.
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 11:36am
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Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE
Had this situation a few weeks back:

Fast break/ breakaway situation. A1 going in for a lay-up on the right side of the basket and puts the ball high up on the glass. As the ball hits the glass, B1 comes in for the block and slaps the backboard, but does not hit the ball. The ball did not go in. I was the T and was a few steps in the frontcourt and passed on the call. Coach A goes nuts, calling for basket interference.

At the next dead ball, the coach is screaming for an explanation to my partner. My partner told him it wasn’t his call. I came over and said, in my opinion there was no basket interference.

After the game, my partner told me I blew it (not very diplomatically BTW). He said it should have been called BI. I was not completely comfortable that I had it right so all I said was I thought it wasn’t since the ball was not on the rim and there was no contact with the ball.

I went back and researched it and wanted to make sure my interpretation is correct. I believe now, based on the rule, I had two options – no calling it, which I did, or calling a technical if, in my opinion, he deliberately slapped the backboard. My interpretation of the rule is that touching the rim, net or backboard does not necessitate a BI call unless the ball is touching the rim. Also, B1 never touched the ball so that was not an option either. Am I correct?

You made the correct call. You had nothing. There is a NFHS Casebook Play that covers your situation and it also applies to NCAA Rules.

MTD, Sr.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 11:42am
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NFHS casebook play 10.3.5 is the citation MTD Sr. was referring to.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 11:54am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
NFHS casebook play 10.3.5 is the citation MTD Sr. was referring to.

JR:

Thank you. I guess I was just too lazy this morning to go to my briefcase and look it up, in fact I was too lazy to go to the NFHS website and look it up there too. Boy am I getting lazy in my old age. Hope you had a Merry Christmas and have a Happy New Year.

MTD, Sr.
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Trumbull Co. (Warren, Ohio) Bkb. Off. Assn.
Wood Co. (Bowling Green, Ohio) Bkb. Off. Assn.
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International Assn. of Approved Bkb. Officials
Ohio High School Athletic Association
Toledo, Ohio
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 12:14pm
MPLAHE
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
NFHS casebook play 10.3.5 is the citation MTD Sr. was referring to.

JR:

Thank you. I guess I was just too lazy this morning to go to my briefcase and look it up, in fact I was too lazy to go to the NFHS website and look it up there too. Boy am I getting lazy in my old age. Hope you had a Merry Christmas and have a Happy New Year.

MTD, Sr.
Mark/JR

thanks for the confirmation. the only thing I second-guessed myself on was whether to call a T for the slap. In my case, it was hard to determine whether he was slapping for show or truly making a concerted effort to block the shot. At what point would you call a T on this type of play?
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 12:19pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
NFHS casebook play 10.3.5 is the citation MTD Sr. was referring to.

JR:

Thank you. I guess I was just too lazy this morning to go to my briefcase and look it up, in fact I was too lazy to go to the NFHS website and look it up there too. Boy am I getting lazy in my old age. Hope you had a Merry Christmas and have a Happy New Year.

MTD, Sr.
Mark/JR

thanks for the confirmation. the only thing I second-guessed myself on was whether to call a T for the slap. In my case, it was hard to determine whether he was slapping for show or truly making a concerted effort to block the shot. At what point would you call a T on this type of play?
If he is making a legitimate play for the ball, leave it alone. If he slaps it to gain an advantage BI, any other reason for the slap could/would be a T or possibly GT.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 01:53pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE

thanks for the confirmation. the only thing I second-guessed myself on was whether to call a T for the slap. In my case, it was hard to determine whether he was slapping for show or truly making a concerted effort to block the shot. At what point would you call a T on this type of play?
I called it once when it was so obvious that everyone in the gym knew there was no play on the ball. It was just showboating. (That wasn't a 6th grade girls' game!) From what I've seen around here, it doesn't get called if there's any chance at all it was part of a play. It has to be pretty egregious to get the T.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 02:21pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
NFHS casebook play 10.3.5 is the citation MTD Sr. was referring to.

JR:

Thank you. I guess I was just too lazy this morning to go to my briefcase and look it up, in fact I was too lazy to go to the NFHS website and look it up there too. Boy am I getting lazy in my old age. Hope you had a Merry Christmas and have a Happy New Year.

MTD, Sr.
I thought it mighta been up in the attic again, Mark.

Hope you and your family are having a good Holiday season too.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 02:24pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by IREFU2
Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE


Mark/JR

thanks for the confirmation. the only thing I second-guessed myself on was whether to call a T for the slap. In my case, it was hard to determine whether he was slapping for show or truly making a concerted effort to block the shot. At what point would you call a T on this type of play?
If he is making a legitimate play for the ball, leave it alone. If he slaps it to gain an advantage BI, any other reason for the slap could/would be a T or possibly GT.
The backboard slap is NEVER BI or GT.

GT ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (in downward flight and above the rim and outside the cylinder such that it has a chance of going in).

BI ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (when it is in the cylinder) or rim/net (when the ball it touching the rim/net or a movable ring hits the ball when returning to a normal position after being pulled down).

If you don't have one of these, you can't have BI or GT.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 02:26pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE
[/B]
At what point would you call a T on this type of play? [/B][/QUOTE]At the point where I had absolutely no doubt at all in my mind that the defender wasn't going for a block. Any doubt at all, I leave it alone. I know that the fans and some coaches will probably be up pointing and screaming for a "T", but that's a non-factor in making the call imo.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 02:43pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust
Quote:
Originally posted by IREFU2
Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE


Mark/JR

thanks for the confirmation. the only thing I second-guessed myself on was whether to call a T for the slap. In my case, it was hard to determine whether he was slapping for show or truly making a concerted effort to block the shot. At what point would you call a T on this type of play?
If he is making a legitimate play for the ball, leave it alone. If he slaps it to gain an advantage BI, any other reason for the slap could/would be a T or possibly GT.
The backboard slap is NEVER BI or GT.

GT ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (in downward flight and above the rim and outside the cylinder such that it has a chance of going in).

BI ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (when it is in the cylinder) or rim/net (when the ball it touching the rim/net or a movable ring hits the ball when returning to a normal position after being pulled down).

If you don't have one of these, you can't have BI or GT.
Uh, if he interferes with the downward flight of the ball after it hits the backboard or pins the ball after its on it way down.....????

But thanks for you input.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 02:48pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust

GT ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (in downward flight and above the rim and outside the cylinder such that it has a chance of going in).
In addition, only a try/tap can be goaltended. Anytime the ball is above the cylinder (for whatever reason), you can have BI.
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Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 02:51pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by IREFU2
Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust
Quote:
Originally posted by IREFU2
Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE


Mark/JR

thanks for the confirmation. the only thing I second-guessed myself on was whether to call a T for the slap. In my case, it was hard to determine whether he was slapping for show or truly making a concerted effort to block the shot. At what point would you call a T on this type of play?
If he is making a legitimate play for the ball, leave it alone. If he slaps it to gain an advantage BI, any other reason for the slap could/would be a T or possibly GT.
The backboard slap is NEVER BI or GT.

GT ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (in downward flight and above the rim and outside the cylinder such that it has a chance of going in).

BI ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (when it is in the cylinder) or rim/net (when the ball it touching the rim/net or a movable ring hits the ball when returning to a normal position after being pulled down).

If you don't have one of these, you can't have BI or GT.
Uh, if he interferes with the downward flight of the ball after it hits the backboard or pins the ball after its on it way down.....????

But thanks for you input.
The backboard has NOTHING to do with either BI or GT.

Did they touch the ball?

Was it coming down, above the level of the basket, with a chance to go in,(GT) or on or within the cylinder or basket(BI)?

Is the backboard part of the basket(BI)?

If they were not playing the ball or were clearly drawing attention to themselves, you have a technical foul, PERIOD.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 28, 2005, 04:49pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by IREFU2
Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust
Quote:
Originally posted by IREFU2
Quote:
Originally posted by MPLAHE


Mark/JR

thanks for the confirmation. the only thing I second-guessed myself on was whether to call a T for the slap. In my case, it was hard to determine whether he was slapping for show or truly making a concerted effort to block the shot. At what point would you call a T on this type of play?
If he is making a legitimate play for the ball, leave it alone. If he slaps it to gain an advantage BI, any other reason for the slap could/would be a T or possibly GT.
The backboard slap is NEVER BI or GT.

GT ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (in downward flight and above the rim and outside the cylinder such that it has a chance of going in).

BI ALWAYS involves contact with the ball (when it is in the cylinder) or rim/net (when the ball it touching the rim/net or a movable ring hits the ball when returning to a normal position after being pulled down).

If you don't have one of these, you can't have BI or GT.
Uh, if he interferes with the downward flight of the ball after it hits the backboard or pins the ball after its on it way down.....????

But thanks for you input.
See my previous post highlighted in red. That is all you need. The involvement of the backboard is irrelevant.

But thanks for your input.
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