End of Game

nukewhistle · #1 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 09, 2005, 02:20pm

Team B makes a basket and is trailing by 2pts with 9 secs remaining in the game. The ball is on the floor rolling under the basket and Team A does not pick up the ball for throw in until 4 secs are remaining. Can Team A just hold the ball and let the clock expire to win the game? When should the lead ref start the throw in count?

RookieDude · #2 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 09, 2005, 02:30pm

Quote:

Originally posted by nukewhistle
Team B makes a basket and is trailing by 2pts with 9 secs remaining in the game. The ball is on the floor rolling under the basket and Team A does not pick up the ball for throw in until 4 secs are remaining. Can Team A just hold the ball and let the clock expire to win the game? When should the lead ref start the throw in count?

Question 1: Yes...if there is 5 seconds or less left in the game.

Question 2: When the ball is at Team A's disposal. This may be the tricky part...it is up to the official's judgement as to when the ball is actually at Team A's disposal.

Edit: Your scenario sounds like the count should have been started by the official before there was only 4 seconds left on the clock...thus, there would have been a throw-in violation before the game ended.

[Edited by RookieDude on Dec 9th, 2005 at 02:34 PM]

blindzebra · #3 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 09, 2005, 02:33pm

When it is clear that A COULD pick it up.

jritchie · #4 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 09, 2005, 02:35pm

if the ball is sitting there at their feet and they are just standing and waiting for the clock to get to 5 seconds, i would start counting when they are next to the ball and aren't making an attempt to pick it up!!!

now if it gets away and they are running after it, don't start counting till they get to it and pick it up, as long as by your judgement that they are not using clock on purpose!!

Ref Daddy · #5 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 09, 2005, 02:40pm

Agree with RD.

Your basically asking can the team ahead waste 4 seconds getting the ball "at their disposal", leaving 5 of the 9 to wait out the 5 second count.

One wonders if the score was reversed just how fast they could a opposed to being ahead in this situation.

Did the scoring team whack the ball away after scoring?
Did they send it towards the base line?
Was it rolling towars the in-bounder?
Could you toss / push it to the in-bounder?

Also I'd be wide eyed in this situation for a "time -out" coming from one of the two bench areas.

rainmaker · #6 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 09, 2005, 06:47pm

If it's clear that the team ahead is just trying to kill the clock, start counting. If you're not 100% sure that's their tactic, you could "see a spot of water on the floor" and stop the clock that way. You could see a violation on the team behind and call that, such as stepping out of bounds, or a uniform violation. If the team behind even so much as brushed the ball, you could call a Delay of Game warning on them, and that would stop the clock.

Dan_ref · #7 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 09, 2005, 08:01pm

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
If it's clear that the team ahead is just trying to kill the clock, start counting. If you're not 100% sure that's their tactic, you could "see a spot of water on the floor" and stop the clock that way. You could see a violation on the team behind and call that, such as stepping out of bounds, or a uniform violation. If the team behind even so much as brushed the ball, you could call a Delay of Game warning on them, and that would stop the clock.

Why would you do any of that?

If the ball's at the disposal then count. Otherwise don't count.

A lot simpler, don't you think?

rainmaker · #8 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 10, 2005, 12:48am

Quote:

Originally posted by Dan_ref

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
If it's clear that the team ahead is just trying to kill the clock, start counting. If you're not 100% sure that's their tactic, you could "see a spot of water on the floor" and stop the clock that way. You could see a violation on the team behind and call that, such as stepping out of bounds, or a uniform violation. If the team behind even so much as brushed the ball, you could call a Delay of Game warning on them, and that would stop the clock.

Why would you do any of that?

If the ball's at the disposal then count. Otherwise don't count.

A lot simpler, don't you think?

I did say to count, after all. But if there seemed to be some problem other than unsportsmanlike strategy, finding a reason to kill the clock seems reasonable, too.

Dan_ref · #9 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 10, 2005, 09:47am

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker

Quote:

Originally posted by Dan_ref

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
If it's clear that the team ahead is just trying to kill the clock, start counting. If you're not 100% sure that's their tactic, you could "see a spot of water on the floor" and stop the clock that way. You could see a violation on the team behind and call that, such as stepping out of bounds, or a uniform violation. If the team behind even so much as brushed the ball, you could call a Delay of Game warning on them, and that would stop the clock.

Why would you do any of that?

If the ball's at the disposal then count. Otherwise don't count.

A lot simpler, don't you think?

I did say to count, after all. But if there seemed to be some problem other than unsportsmanlike strategy, finding a reason to kill the clock seems reasonable, too.

Sure, if you're a member of team B.

Otherwise, no.

Ref Daddy · #10 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 10, 2005, 10:35am

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
If it's clear that the team ahead is just trying to kill the clock, start counting. If you're not 100% sure that's their tactic, you could "see a spot of water on the floor" and stop the clock that way. You could see a violation on the team behind and call that, such as stepping out of bounds, or a uniform violation. If the team behind even so much as brushed the ball, you could call a Delay of Game warning on them, and that would stop the clock.

If I'm not 100% sure they are "wasting time" my thoughts would be to let it pass to - not to look for something disquised as a violation.

I got 9 seconds left in a tight game, ball under basket for after a score and I call a uniform violation ..... e- gad's Batman.

I suggest a lazer beam focus on getting the ball to the throw in position. If I can get it (the ball) reasonably still near the baseline - I can start a visable count and thats powerful. Players will respond as you know.

Admire the creative thinking and game management - but in the frenzy of a big finish finding "water on the floor" would be a tough sell.

blindzebra · #11 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 10, 2005, 12:47pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Ref Daddy

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
If it's clear that the team ahead is just trying to kill the clock, start counting. If you're not 100% sure that's their tactic, you could "see a spot of water on the floor" and stop the clock that way. You could see a violation on the team behind and call that, such as stepping out of bounds, or a uniform violation. If the team behind even so much as brushed the ball, you could call a Delay of Game warning on them, and that would stop the clock.

If I'm not 100% sure they are "wasting time" my thoughts would be to let it pass to - not to look for something disquised as a violation.

I got 9 seconds left in a tight game, ball under basket for after a score and I call a uniform violation ..... e- gad's Batman.

I suggest a lazer beam focus on getting the ball to the throw in position. If I can get it (the ball) reasonably still near the baseline - I can start a visable count and thats powerful. Players will respond as you know.

Admire the creative thinking and game management - but in the frenzy of a big finish finding "water on the floor" would be a tough sell.

Perhaps the old insurance scam slip and fall would sell the whistle?