The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 04, 2001, 10:14pm
certified Hot Mom tester
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: only in my own mind, such as it is
Posts: 12,918
Question

I was flipping channels between hockey and basketball and just caught the end of what appeared to be a 5 second count in the Raptors - Knicks game against the Knicks when they were on offense. Can anyone explain what happened? Thanks.

I know there used to be an "illegal offensive set" violation in the NBA where 4 players were on the weak side above the free throw line. Was this it?
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 04, 2001, 11:29pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 252
Exclamation Nailed!

Sure, Mark, I was watching.

I can't tell you who the players were, but NY brought the ball down and the guard (?) was "defended" by the Raptor -- quite close. The official was right behind the NY guard and started a 5-second count -- very visible! After 5 counts (I counted with him, admittedly out loud) he blew the whistle, held up the 5 digits, and they went the other way.

I must say I have rarely seen this called in the NBA, but generally they break off in time. Dumb offensive play to get caught on that.

I don't watch enough NBA to recognize the illegal defense; we're encouraged NOT to watch NBA during the season so as not to contaminate our judgment.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 04, 2001, 11:44pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 87
The 5 second call was against Glenn Rice and it really had nothing to do with being closely guarded. In the NBA once you turn your back to the basket, with the ball and are below the foul-line you only have 5 seconds to make your offensive more. This rule is commonly called the Charles Barkley rule because he would get the ball on the block and stick out he big backside and just dribble the ball for 10 to 15 seconds before shooting. The idea is to speed up the game and get rid of the "bum" ball as it is called. I was surprized to see it called though in the playoffs. It is rarely ever called period.

Though even stranger was the "illegal offense" call made against the Raptors earlier in the game. They isolated Vince on a wing and then had all 4 of their other players on the other side of the hoop above the 3-point line. I had never seen that called before. The announcer even said that the reason Lenny Wilkens was arguing was because he did not understand what the call was. LOL.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 04, 2001, 11:52pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 252
Quote:
Originally posted by Dewey1
... once you turn your back to the basket....
Hmm. My recollection was that Glenn was facing the defender and the basket. In fact, this is supported by him not seeing the official counting, because the official was standing right behind him. Now I wish I had taped the game.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Sat May 05, 2001, 01:17am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 1,277
The illegal offense call as you refer to it is an illegal isolation call. It is not called often. I know it was called a few times on the Jazz when Mark Eaton played. I am sure there are others, and the 5 second backdown call has been around a couple of years!
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sat May 05, 2001, 01:28am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 14,612
Actually, if his back or side is to the basket, the count starts. Basically, he has to be facing the basket. It's also the first time that I've ever seen it called. It appeared to me that the officials were specifically looking for a possible violation by Rice. Ed F. Rush started the count immediately.

However, I have seen isolation called on the offense before. If Carter was isolated on one side of the floor and at least 3 teammates are positioned above the tip of the circle on the weakside, it's a violation.
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott

"You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 07, 2001, 09:09am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Just north of hell
Posts: 9,250
Send a message via AIM to Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Padgett
I was flipping channels between hockey and basketball ...
Hey Mark, I'm impressed you could tell the difference
playoff NBA & playoff NHL!
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 07, 2001, 10:53am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 14,612
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Padgett
I was flipping channels between hockey and basketball ...
Hey Mark, I'm impressed you could tell the difference
playoff NBA & playoff NHL!
OUCH! Whaddya think? Should Juwan Howard have been ejected?
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott

"You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 07, 2001, 11:38am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Just north of hell
Posts: 9,250
Send a message via AIM to Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by BktBallRef
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Padgett
I was flipping channels between hockey and basketball ...
Hey Mark, I'm impressed you could tell the difference
playoff NBA & playoff NHL!
OUCH! Whaddya think? Should Juwan Howard have been ejected?
Nah, just a 2 minute minor (or maybe just send him back to
Michigan
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 07, 2001, 02:45pm
certified Hot Mom tester
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: only in my own mind, such as it is
Posts: 12,918
Talking

Quote:
Hey Mark, I'm impressed you could tell the difference
playoff NBA & playoff NHL!

OUCH! Whaddya think? Should Juwan Howard have been ejected?
Of course, I don't have the same visual perspective watching on television as the official on the floor has, but since you asked - it looked like a flagrant level 1 to me. He really did make a quasi-attempt at the ball.

BTW - here's the latest on what's going to happen with the Trailblazers here in Portland. They're keeping Rasheed Wallace, firing Mike Dunleavy and replacing him with former coach P.J. Carlismo, trading to get Latrelle Sprewell from the Knicks and then having the team join the NHL.

Or maybe the WWF.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 07, 2001, 09:20pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 14,612
Might I suggest the XFL!
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott

"You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 08, 2001, 12:07am
certified Hot Mom tester
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: only in my own mind, such as it is
Posts: 12,918
Talking

I forgot one thing - Bobby Knight as assistant coach.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 08, 2001, 07:34am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 411
5 second count

Actually, the isolation violation is for 3 players or
more above the tip of the circle on the weakside.
And I'm surprised Mark, that you made the statement,
that because Howard made a "Quasi-attempt" to play the ball,
it should have been only a Flagrant 1. Sounds like a coach.;-)
A Flagrant 2 usually calls itself. And when Derek Anderson
went "*** over tea-kettle", that "called itself." IMHO of course.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 08, 2001, 08:53am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 14,612
Thumbs up Re: 5 second count

Quote:
Originally posted by DrakeM
Actually, the isolation violation is for 3 players or
more above the tip of the circle on the weakside.
Actually, this is exactly what I said in my first post.
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott

"You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 08, 2001, 09:06am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 411
Wink

Actually, you're right!
Sorry I missed it.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:42am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1